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Equal Parts Heart Over Equal Parts Money
Dear Annie: My husband and I work comparable hours, but I earn less than half of what he does and have little discretionary income. I come home to my "second shift," which includes cooking, cleaning and picking up after this man, who leaves his dirty clothes, snack packaging and other things strewn about the house. Meanwhile, he runs off to play golf. After dinner, he falls asleep in front of the TV. He doesn't even mow the lawn or do routine household maintenance. He hires out for those things.
Anything he's asked to do, he deflects by saying "I pay." To an extent, this is true. He pays the majority of household bills. But I pay for most of the food and all of the household products (bathroom tissue, toothpaste, shampoo) that we both use. I even keep a garden to help pad our grocery bill in the summer months.
I've told him I feel like his servant. I don't earn enough to hire a housekeeper. And don't tell me to go on strike. I've tried it, and he is perfectly content to live in a pigsty. He says I'm a clean freak. I am not. I simply cannot live in such clutter and filth.
Other than this, he's a good man, intelligent, fun, and he makes me laugh. I'm not ready to throw us away for this problem. But I admit there are days when the idea of living alone is very appealing. He reads you faithfully and respects your opinion. Please help. — Lake-Effect Wife
Dear Wife: Marriage is a partnership. Married couples who have disparate incomes and insist on splitting the bills often run into these problems. Since you work the same hours, you should both do equal amounts of housework and share laundry and cooking duties. Since he doesn't do these things, however, and you are picking up his used food containers and dirty clothes, cooking the meals and doing his laundry, he should pay for cleaning help. And no, this does not mean you are a clean freak. It means you are avoiding a visit by the board of health.
Dear Annie: A couple of my friends are recovering from illness and accidents, and their family members keep us updated through CaringBridge.org, a wonderful website. I just don't understand why some authors know no boundaries.
I recently read an update saying, "Johnny is now having a good solid stool every day." Really? Did Johnny want that shared with the world? And on another site: "Mary is seeing a psychologist for help with her anger toward her family."
There is no shame in bowel movements or psychology, but please, out of respect for the person, skip those details. Just tell us the basics of how they are doing and feeling. I have informed my kids and siblings that if I ever need such a site, they are not to mention my urine output.
I'm thankful for CaringBridge, as it is a great way to let people know how a friend is doing. But I am sad for the patient whose privacy is sometimes a casualty. — Not-So-Nosy Nellie
Dear Nellie: Thank you for pointing out that not all details need to be disclosed to everyone, a concept many people no longer grasp. And thank you, too, for giving us the opportunity to once again mention CaringBridge.org.
Dear Annie: "S.P." said she no longer trusts her husband of many years. Yes, it's possible he will someday stop his philandering. But she should also consider what any philanderer could bring home to a spouse: STDs.
A lot of things can be forgiven (and medically treated), but some sexually transmitted diseases are with you for the rest of your life. Our society may take casual affairs with a grain of salt, but we should be reminded now and then that affairs can kill you. — Another Side in California
Annie's Mailbox is written by Kathy Mitchell and Marcy Sugar, longtime editors of the Ann Landers column. Please email your questions to anniesmailbox@comcast.net, or write to: Annie's Mailbox, c/o Creators Syndicate, 737 3rd Street, Hermosa Beach, CA 90254. To find out more about Annie's Mailbox and read features by other Creators Syndicate writers and cartoonists, visit the Creators Syndicate Web page at www.creators.com.
COPYRIGHT 2012 CREATORS.COM
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Comments
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14 Comments | Post Comment
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LW1 - I'm not sure what advice you seek. You have laid your cards on the table and tried to reason with your husband who has made it clear as day that he doesn't care. In his mind, he makes more, and that's what matters (I guess he forgot the "partnership" part of marriage!) and he is not going to change. So, are you willing to live like that forever? Or are you willing to work harder than your husband, resenting it the whole way, because he has other good qualities? Only you can answer that.
The only workable suggestions I have would be that he hire a cleaner to clean up his mess. You do not say you have any kids so if the cleaning were done by a maid, your chores would be more manageable. Or you could explore finding a different job with a higher salary or less work hours. But would you still resent your husband, or would you see it as an acceptable tradeoff?
LW2 - Ah, well, good thing you wrote into an advice column. Tell these people yourself, you passive-aggressive complainy-pants.
And by the way, I find poop to be very interesting and I'm not alone. I would share more details about it if it were socially acceptable!
Since these people are unlikely to a) read Annies, b) see themselves in your letter, and c) desire to change their behaviour in d) a way you consider acceptable, you should probably just skip that site. Instead, give them a call to ask how they are doing. You can hang up on them if they give you more details than you are comfortable with.
Comment: #1
Posted by: Zoe
Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:09 PM
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LW1 - suggest you live apart. Stay married but each of you live in your own space, be it apartment or condo or house, and then you can keep it the way you like. It doesn't sound like you have kids which would complicate the situation. If living alone appeals, then live alone and get together when you want to be together.
Comment: #2
Posted by: kai archie
Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:13 PM
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LW1 - the main thing wrong with your situation is that your husband is paying for someone to do his chores, while you have to do yours. Tell him that just as he's paying people to mow the lawn, clean the gutters, etc., etc., he needs to pay someone to do the housecleaning and all of the other things you're doing. This is totally reasonable; he's the one with the money. And also he needs to pay his share of the food and household supplies. It's time to stop presenting things in terms of your "feelings," hoping your feeling as you do will sway him. Instead, present it as a requirement, and a condition for staying married.
Kai Archie's suggestion is also worth considering.
Comment: #3
Posted by: sarah morrow
Tue Feb 14, 2012 10:15 PM
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Kai: If LW1's husband really doesn't care how neat his living area is or what he eats, your idea might solve the problem. Let him live with his slobbiness, and let her live in the neat environment she wants and deserves. However, I doubt it's just a mismatch in their standards, because he's willing to pay people to do some of the chores. What he seems to want, and what he's getting, is a grossly underpaid servant. Real partners devote equal effort to their lives together, regardless of how the outside world values their talents. This "good, intelligent man" sounds like a passive-aggressive jerk. A real man doesn't sit on his ass while his wife does all the work.
Comment: #4
Posted by: Baldrz
Tue Feb 14, 2012 10:29 PM
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Re LW1: Just a thought--I wonder if, instead of going on a house cleaning strike, she's considered telling her husband that she's considering quitting her job so that she can devote all her time to maintaining the home. Maybe once he realizes that he'd be on the hook for 100% of the household expenses, he might be more receptive to the alternative of hiring a part-time housekeeper.
Comment: #5
Posted by: Jeanne
Wed Feb 15, 2012 12:45 AM
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I admit to not knowing the facts, so what I'm about to say may not have a factual basis...and it won't be popular...but...here goes:
Is it not possible that hubby feels, after years of acquiring skills, education and working hard, while watching wife not work similarly, that he wants to reap the rewards of his labour and take it easy when he can, and that he does not feel it unfair that she work a bit harder than he?
He might resent working hard only to be left living life at the lowest common denominator.
I see this all the time. It astounds me that, to this day, young women still are not pursuing careers with the same vigor. A large number (no,not all) still want "jobettes" to hold them over just until they marry and have kids.
Comment: #6
Posted by: Jpp
Wed Feb 15, 2012 1:10 AM
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Jpp--
Just because the wife earns less doesn't mean she hasn't worked similarly to acquire skills and education. Social workers, for example, aren't paid particularly well, but they have at least 4-year degrees, and often Master's degrees. Same with teachers. Lawyers engaged in public service also don't make much money, but it doesn't mean they don't work hard. How hard you work at a job, unfortunately, does not always correlate to how well you get paid. She implied they both work full-time, so there's really nothing in the letter to imply that she considers her work a "jobette."
And even if she is working below her potential, and that is his attitude, he'd still be wrong. Just because someone WANTS to sit around and not contribute to the housework doesn't mean that person is entitled to do so. These things need to be negotiated. Maybe she could stand to relax her standards (although it doesn't sound like she needs things to be spotless" but he needs to respect her feelings and contributions enough to actually be in a partnership with her. How much you make (or even how much housework you do) does not define how much value you bring to a relationship.
There may be situations where a spouse would be justified in thinking the way you've outlined. However, the spouses still need to communicate and come to an agreement regarding their expectations, and not just assume that it's only "fair" for the lower-earning partner to pick up the slack. Resentment is toxic to relationships, and it should be avoided, no matter who is technically "right."
Comment: #7
Posted by: Laura
Wed Feb 15, 2012 1:39 AM
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LW1-
In all fairness, how much who pays for bills is expected to be divited on a pro-rate basis according to respective income. Right now, it is.
In all fairness, the amount of houselhold chores is also expected to be divided on a pro-rata basis according to respective work hours. Right now, it isn't.
Considering your hours are the same, the amount of leisure time you both have, once working hours and household chores are done, should also be the same. It's not fair that you should come home to twice the work compared to him. It's ESPECIALLY not fair that some of the work should be dumped on you by his own carelessness.
Can't go on strike? What Jeanne said.
And if your income is so low, have you considered upgrading your skills so you can land a better job? Ditch the garden and start doing only your own laundry (for instance) to save some time you need for part-time studies. Enlist his rightful cooperation for the rest. He "pays"? Let him pay for housekeeping help then. That doesn't mean you no longer do your share, only that he pays for his, which right now he is not doing. The improved income will be at both your advantage anyway, not just yours, because your share of the bills will increase proportionally to your income.
He reads the Annies faithfully? I hope not just in the paper, where not only he doesn't have the commentary, but where the paper editors treat it like a filler and chop it down even further than the Annies themselves do. That's why I started reading it online!
The Annies were sensible for once. If that is not enough to wake him up, I suggest a marriage counsellor, but if he doesn't listen to the Annies, whose advice he allegedly respects, he's not likely to listen to the counsellor. Perhaps if the counsellor is a man?
LW2-
Unfortunately, because they cannot see who they talk to, some people treat online communications as if they were alone and doing a version of talking to themselves. There are real hands belonging to real people behind every post - be it on FaceBook, CaringBridge... or BTL.
Perhaps you should tell these people how you feel yourself, instead of writing in to an advice columnist. They're not likely to read the Annies and, even if they do, it won't necessarily dawn on them that this applies them. For you to bring the problem here does a social service by advising the public in general, but it does nothing to fix it in your own life.
Comment: #8
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Wed Feb 15, 2012 1:40 AM
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While I agree with LW2 that the postings on CaringBridge about the patient's intimate medical conditions may be embarrasing to the patient, and probably should be limited to less personal information about their progress and recovery, I agree totally with the BTL posters here that the families and friends who post there probably have other things to do rather than read advice columns. Why write to the Annies about this -- talk PERSONALLY to the people who are posting on CaringBridge and tell THEM how it may make the patient feel. They are probably so happy to report any progress their loved one is making, that they don't realize it may be humilitating to them to find out that other people know all about their bodily functions in that manner.
Comment: #9
Posted by: Kitty
Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:34 AM
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LW1 - Wow, Annie, great advice! Tell him he has to pay for a maid. Yeah, I'm sure he'll grab his wallet and pay immediatly! In the letter, she clearly states that he feels the housecleaning his "her" job and he only pays for "his" chores.
Honestly, I like kai's suggestion of staying married but living apart. My best friend's parents do that. Her mother just couldn't take the endless clutter and him blowing money on useless stuff. So she told him she was moving out but wanted to stay married. He was, of course, livid at first. But he calmed down and now they've been living apart but married for 10 years. It works for them.
Jpp - What Laura said is right. There are a lot of careers out there that don't pay based on how hard you work. I have a career, not a joblette, but I don't make a lot of money at all. I can't afford much. But I work hard! I don't get paid to sit on my butt and twiddle my thumbs. I chose my career not based on how much money I would make but because I love what I do. Sure, I wish I could make more money, but I know if I switched careers I would not be happy.
Besides, marriage is an equal partnership. Your rank should not be determined on how much money you make. My mother makes waaaaay less than my father does and he has never - not once - ever made her feel bad for that. I have girlfriends that make more than their husbands and they have never made their husbands feel bad for that. It's not even brought up.
Comment: #10
Posted by: Michelle
Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:50 AM
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LW1--"Other than this, he's a good man, intelligent, fun, and he makes me laugh." Yeah, he sounds like a real gem and your letter didn't sound very funny to me. While your husband accuses you of being a clean freak, he's a penny pincher. In the back of his mind, he's accounted for every dime you've spent on the marriage versus how much he spends and has decided that you're going to make up for your shortfall by being his indentured servant. While your husband may not be doing this consciously the result is the same nonetheless. While he sits around on his duff using his excess funds to pay people to cut the grass and do maintenance on the house, you're killing yourself trying to pick up after a pig who can't muster the common courtesy to place a dish in the sink or a garment in the hamper. This is a classic case of passive aggression. The two of you need marriage counseling pronto. In the meantime tell your intelligent fun husband that all you want for your birthday and Christmas this year is a Molly Maid twice a week. If he doesn't comply, then maybe you're too tired from all the housework to fool around in the bedroom.
LW2--Some people have no common sense whatsoever. The advent of social networking and the ease at which one can share the minutia of their lives with half the world has made people lose all sense of boundaries. In my opinion, some websites are solutions waiting for a problem. My advice to you is to get off CaringBridge.org and do things the old fashioned way. Pick up the phone. You won't know about Johnny's solid stools if you're not on the computer reading about it. Moreover, most people's manners and sense of dignity and decorum seem to manifest in real life interactions where they will be able to read tone of voice or body language and censor squeamish details or curtail the amount of personal information they offer in face to face or telephone conversations. Just because you have a computer or a SmartPhone doesn't mean you have to use it for everything.
Comment: #11
Posted by: Chris
Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:54 AM
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Zoe, LW1 wanted only the Annie's opinion, because she believes her otherwise intelligent husband will respect their opinion.
IF LW is reading here -- tell your hubby to that more earning power = more clout at home is an outdated belief. One'. Earning power comes and goes over the course of a lifetime, particularly so these days, often through no fault of a hard-working individual.
If he were disabled, if his company were sold, if he were laid -- or, conversely, if YOU inherited big bucks, won the lottery or got a huge promotion by way of a big achievement at work, you could end up the major breadwinner. If he continues to think as he does, you'd be justified in saying that your marriage is a luxury you, yourself, cannot afford on your salary, because the mental and emotional cost of being treated as menial labor are taking too great a toll on your relationship -- that you'd be better off seeing each other from separate residences.
Comment: #12
Posted by: hedgehog
Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:13 AM
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Re: Zoe, 1- i agree in part with what you said about telling the posters that they are posting tmi. having said that, my doctor knows not to release any information to my family without my prior approval. my family knows that i cherish my privacy in certain areas. posting information online about a good solid stool is ok if johnny doesn't mind, but if johnny has a reasonable expectation of privacy, it's out of line. if i were the patient i would be livid. i know there is nothing shameful about defecation, but i wouldn't do it where people are watching...and it is not a topic for conversation.
if you want all of your intimate personal functions posted online for all the world to see, go right ahead. but i'm opting out of having any information posted.
Comment: #13
Posted by: alien07110
Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:22 AM
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OK but does she visit him in the filthy house? Or does he come over to her place and trash it? Would he visit with her, make love? Or does he just want her to cook his dinner?
Comment: #14
Posted by: sarah stravinska
Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:33 AM
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