Immigrants -- Good or Bad?

Legal immigration is a good thing and is far too restrictive. However, we, as a nation, have a right to know who is coming here, their background and what they are doing here.

For those who propose no border or no border enforcement, I have a question: "Do you lock your doors at night?"
If the answer is "no", then I will just stop by and eat what I want, use your beds, etc. Thanks for your hospitality and thanks for your consistency of argument. If your answer is "yes", then why do think our country can't "lock its doors?"

California was called "an immigration disaster" by Senator Feinstein in 1995 Senate Judiciary Committee hearing. K-12 schools have gone from best to 48th in the nation and are now 48% Latino. Projections for first half of century per CA Department of Finance show growth from 34 to 60 million with non-Hispanic whites steady at 16 m and Latinos from 11 to 31 million. www.BillionAmericans.com states our young people will be living in a third world country unless growth is sustainable. Oil consumption, environment, education, water supplies are more important than third world population growth fueled by immigration. We all suffer in quality of life so that "cheap labor" and undocumented Democrats can flourish.

As a long time and ardent Stossel fan....and a Libertarian...I seldom disagree with your views..HOWEVER, I disagree with you over this article : " Immigrants: Good or Bad?".
Let me try to explain a few 'facts of life' to you:
I recently retired after 29 years of working as a Nurse Practitioner (NP) ....I practiced in CA, AZ, OR., and Iowa....and in each of these states my clinic had many families who were' illegals '....YET they were receiving welfare, and 'entitled' to receive benefits from the State & Feds: i.e.: WIC (provides coupons for food/formula etc for kids from birth to age 5), food stamps, welfare payments, free health care, free dental care, free education , etc etc etc... And you may ask me..."Why would they be entitled to all these IF they were illegal?"....
Because:... the USA has a 'tradition' of offering US citizenship to babies born to illegal parents ( IE: 'anchor babies')..... so once the baby is born...the newborn is deemed a US citizen and therefore 'qualifies' for citizenship and all the 'entitlements' available.... since the newborn is obviously a part of the nuclear - but illegal -family ...ALL members of the family therefore benefit from the food stamps, health care, welfare payments, etc. Many times this includes Grandparents/Uncles/Aunts, etc). Many of these families are also on the 'welfare rolls' for YEARS.
Furthermore, many illegal Mothers told me that they were actually married in Mexico, ( many times, their husbands were also here illegally and using fake social security cards to work...another issue for another time! )..BUT, many of these married Moms declared that they were 'single' because they could more easily qualify for the entitlement programs by simply telling the social workers that they were a 'single Mom' with children since the social workers do not ask for proof of citizenship either.
In EVERY clinic where I worked, we had a large percentage of our patients who were illegal...However, that fact was never recorded on a patient's chart because our Govt. forbids us to ask about citizenship. THAT question is considered discrimination! The same thing happens when the child goes to school...NO questions are asked regarding citizenship.
Please bear in mind.....I am definitely NOT against immigration.... I have a great deal of respect for LEGAL immigrants However, I am also aware that my patients and families who arrived in the USA- LEGALLY.....are NOT in favor of amnesty for illegals..they display a lot of resentment toward those folks who do come to this country illegally..... Bottom line............> The word 'Illegal'.... should mean 'illegal' !!!
I can't go to Mexico without proper documentation...and Mexican rules are much more rigid than those of the USA.
So why is it OK for Mexico to enforce their border BUT it's not OK for the USA to enforce our border??? What happened to our common sense??

Donna, I loved what you wrote. It's great to see those perspectives. Of course the US needs to rethink the current laws in place to regulate immigrants. Honestly politicians? America should be the land of opportunity. But we need to keep a better balance between the land of opportunity and the land with loop holes to let you stay here legally. Unfortunatley, it's hard to ignore the fact that immigration was, at one time, vital to Americas economic and cultural growth. So I suggest a compromise: let well qualified workers come in more easily (poeple that have potential to further the economy), while putting up a better barrier against those immigrants that are going to only take jobs from high school students. Just a suggestion.
TIMBAP_SDW

Prologue: We're not struglling with "illegal immigration," but with invasion, which is perforce illegal. Armed and dangerous invaders should be shot dead; other invaders should be repulsed with minimum necessary force. This, of course, won't happen. You've addressed and dismissed the load the invaders put on our education and health care systems. Give a staffer the task of gathering statistics on diseases "imported" through invasion. We have dengue fever, drug resistant tuberculosis, and -- incredibly -- leprosy back in our nation because of the invaders!

Dear Mr. Stossel !
There is no reason to be "confused" about "immigration". - I tis obvious, that a CERTAIN AMOUNT of well qualified legal immigrants is beneficial to any industrialized country..... The question is HOW MANY and with what skills ... !!!!
The fact is, that today, with the third world drowning in people, the US and Europe are overrun with the wrong type of mostly illegal immigrants, and blessed with only a few of the desirable types. - A few more decades of the same immigration mismanagemnt like the last 2, and we, the western world will go broke under the burden of these unsustainable social costs. - Mathematics 101 !
Good luck and best eregards ! Giorgio

I feel that the federal government's present response to the immigration issue is in contradiction with its proposed national health care bill. Our nation needs to rediscover an ability to make reasoned and measured responses to the inevitable situational "crises". In particular, a national health care plan cannot be reasonably and rationally implemented without taking into consideration the number of illegal immigrants that are entering the country.

And illegal immigrant is a double economic threat because much of the money they earn is sent out of the country while they do not pay the same taxes to support the infrastructure that they are enjoying. Not to address this issue and it's effect on the proposed health care plan is an irrational move on the part of the present administration.

I am not in a position with a broad enough economic view to make a firm assessment of whether immigrants are "good" or "bad" for our economy, however, I am fairly certain that funneling some federal resources into properly managing the current influx would be cheaper than prolonging this "debate".

IMHP immigrants are good if, and only if, they are highly skilled, well educated and want to be Americans. Most of the legal and nearly all of the illegal immigrants to this Country since 1965 do not meet this criteria. We desparately need to scale back the number of legal immigrants to pre-1965 level and we need to abandon the family preference immigration category. Chain migration needs to end immediately.

Milton Friedman didn't understand the resourcefullness of illegal immigrants in obtaining access to government funded welfare programs through the use of fraudlent documents and legal resident relatives, nor did he understand the negative impact of millions of undocumented aliens on the pysche of legal Americans. Lack of immigration control is nothing less than an unfundated mandate on taxpaying citizens.

The anchor baby issue is much bigger than most people think. PEW Hispanic Research Center reported that in 2008 there were 4 million minor children in the US with one or both parents undocumented aliens. Couple that with our "family preference" immigration category and you have the formula for uncontrolled legal and illegal immigration. If something is not done to eliminate "jus soli", we will never be able to control illegal immigration.

Those who argue that illegal immigrants are less likely to commit crimes should be reminded that it is the children of illegal immigrants that are the problem. I'm sure it has something to do with the depressed living conditions they are born into, english language deficiencies and cultural differences.

I live in the center of gravity of this issue, Tucson AZ, and you must experience it for yourseft to apppreciate just how bad it is. I've seen a steady decline in the relationship between the native hispanic and white population since illegal immigration skyrocketed in the 2000's. We had become good friends and neighbors with a common language and values. Now, I just don't know.

John, the idea of open borders is just plain whacky unless you want the average American to live like the average Mexican. You need to stand on a hilltop in Nogales, AZ and look across the line at Nogales, Mexico. If you are like me you will just ask yourself, "Why?". I wish we could just annex Mexico and Central America, make them all US citizens and be done with it.

Two points that were not covered:
1) This is an age of socialized education and healthcare. Not so back when Stossel's parents immigrated; the poor that come here use more of the benefits without paying the burden to buy them. Education is paid mainly from property taxes, and they don't buy health insurance. I pay $800 a month, and the local hospital administrator said that those that have money pay for those that don't- in higher costs for surgery, etc. We can't afford to let anyone come here when they can't contribute equally to the standard of living. Schools are burdened with non-English speakers, and the whole class slows down to accomodate them: thus, worse education for English speakers.
2) Many illegal immigrants obviously can't be hired, (without documentation), and US citizens are fined if they have not checked to ensure they are legal; so they can't secure good paying jobs. The result is that they rent a small home, pack it with several families (using the garage as well) and the neighborhood deteriorates. They can all get clunker cars, the kids begin to get hooked into local gangs, grafitti and crime DO skyrocket. They do not assimilate well, often not bothering to learn English. Then they have the audacity to march in US streets to protest the fact that we are unhappy with paying their way.
Every other Western country has a policy that you have to have a talent deemed useful to the country, and a certain, usually substancial amount of money as well before you are considered for permanent immigrant status. We must do the same. This is not the world of the 19th & 20th centuries. People here are cared for, and there is a limit to how many can take more than is taxed. Legal immigration, yes.

Throw out all of the cliches about America being the "land of opportunity" and the "melting pot of the world". My county of 56,000 people is heavy with illegals and there have been 72 crimes committed in the last month, including finding a woman's head - no body - less than two blocks from my home. Forget about owning a bicycle, illegals snatch them out of your hands. Virtually every crime in this county are caused by illegals. Last Sunday morning at 2:00 a.m. there was a gunfight 100 yards from my home, and i live in a nice middle-class area. Illegals? Drug deal gone wrong? 100 to 1 it was both. There are no jobs here for kids or college students. No jobs for landscapers, roofers, painters, waiters, clerks, mechanics, concrete contractors - they are all taken by illegals who do not pay taxes and who undercut legitimate contractors who want to pay good wages, buy bonds and insurance, and offer quality service. There is one area of our downtown that regularly has at least two dozen illegals drinking wine, tossing trash, and cursing at passing women. The police? Their hands our tied by our socialist City Council that has declared the city a "sanctuary city" and provides free food, clothing, and allows them to sleep in the streets. God help America.

I wish people would discuss why we have an immigration problem in the first place? NAFTA has caused the economic and social problems of Mexico to become much worse. Free trade and unregulated foreign investments mostly benefit large corporations and the wealthy. Local companies are wiped out and small farmers are priced out of the market by food imported tariff-free. Consequently, these desperate people are forced to leave their families and head north in search of jobs. Besides, Indigenous peoples from this continent are NOT immigrants and are NOT illegal aliens and do have some sovereign rights here!! But some people commenting here seem to be totally incapable of feeling sympathy or empathy for these economic refugees. Nor can they fully understand how unethical and unconstitutional Arizona's immigration bill really is

John... I'm watching your "Immigration" show on Fox tonight [723/10-19:52pdt]. I have a solution.
1. Eliminate Anchor baby rule.
2. Allow free entrance with the intent of employment.
3. Employers must pay prevailing wages [some day we'll get rid of minimum wage]. This way, employers can't take advantage of "Slave Labor"
4. Eliminate 'freebies', or tax immigrants on par with citizens for schools, etc. Preferably, make school available for an equivalent price.
5. DO NOT MAKE CITIZENSHIP A REQUIREMENT OF IMMIGRATION. {not all immigrants necessarily want to be citizens.]
6. Side comments: Immigration in the late 1800's was for a different reason - America was expanding industrially needing all intellectual levels of immigrants [engineers/scientists as well as basic labor] The reason it takes longer for Engineers from India to matriculate than those from Africa is that there are many more Indian applicants [if the system tries to balance entrance among countries, 100 Africans and 100 Indians, the average time for the Indians is obviously longer]
7. I have more ideas, but don't want Facebook to be the vehicle of discourse. Call me some time and lets discuss it between us [I'm to shy to be in front of too many others, and to inarticulate verbally and in writing to do justice to this subject.
PS: I am a proponent of Freedom. [100% control of one's own Property - from Andrew J. Galambos.] I believe that Freedom is the natural state of Man, and that politics is the invention of those who want to have someone else to blame for their irresponsibility. Politicians are willing to take the risks associated for that job - and they know how to game the process to their advantage.
It was because early America didn't have a constitution and had almost total Freedom for 11 years that we are` the greatest country in the world. That was all the time it took to establish the concept of Freedom in our lives.
More can be discussed re a trully Free society...

In your immigration show, part of your discussion by the experts centered around whether or not the current "wave" of immigration was the same as previous waves of immigration--the Irish, the Germans, etc. One issue that I did not hear raised in this or any other debate which I have heard was the public displays by the illegal immigrants extolling Mexico over the US. The Irish, discriminated against as they were, were not out in the streets waving the Irish flag and yelling the Irish equivalent of "Viva Ireland!" The Germans did not form public groups claiming that Germany was the rightful owner of large parts of the American Southwest. I think that part of the vitriol in the debate is either driven by or intensified by the fear that this wave of immigrants comes not to assimilate but to invade. It's difficult to tell what proportion of illegal Hispanic immigrants identify with these elements in their ranks. It's disturbing.
Even in this, there is a historical similarity. In WWII, American Citizens from Japan and German were perceived to have a greater loyalty to their original country than to the United States. It was this perception, true for only some of those immigrants, that caused them to be discriminated against not as the individuals they were under the Constitution, but as members of a group.
I would love to hear some experts debate this issue.

Illegal is just illegal and this country was doing fine before we were flooded with the ILLEGAL kind. Illegal aliens DO GET WELFARE!!! I dont know where you heard they didn't but, I went into the Dept of Health and Welfare in Idaho to find out if they really do get it because I just couldn't believe that I was living on Ramen noodles and working full time while they were filling up TWO carts of food at the grocery store..sure enough the hispanic female working there said yes they do get welfare and not only that, they are not required to report the illegals as being here illegaly..each illegal takes home approx 1200. and more a month depending on how many kids they have.. According to recent polls there are about 12 million here illegaly and only account forl 2.5 million of them working..sooo, that means there are most likely 9.5 million of them on welfare or smuggling and dealing drugs..drug dealers, another reason not to open borders terrorists, freeloaders who receive free everythng here while most legal Americans work full time to pay for it.. I hope this helps you to understand a little better.

Re: Anita Quintanilla
We need to send all the illegal aliens home to Mexico where they can be taken care of there...maybe the US should go to war with the mexican government because they dont take care of their poor people!! Its not the americans responsibility to do it!! Its not my responsibility either, I can barely make ends meet as it is and you want my tax dollars to go to these people who are not even here legally?? what is wrong with you?? You should be standing up for the legal people of this country and feeling a little empathy for us!!! A lot of legal citizens cant even find jobs!! Again, what is wrong with you??

Re: John Sorg
That is very well put, thank you...someone with some intelligence here.

Re: Maggie
Very good post here..resources are definately something to protect..

Re: Donna
Thanks Donna, you said everything I was thinking about when I read illegals dont get welfare..I also read another post that mentions the fact that we need to protect our resources from over population as well..there are some really great posts here..

Re: Donna
Thanks Donna, you said everything I was thinking about when I read illegals dont get welfare..I also read another post that mentions the fact that we need to protect our resources from over population as well..there are some really great posts here..

Mr Stossel, I always considered you one of the few in the media that actually did your research. I do believe that you dropped the ball on this one.
My Mother the Granddaughter of immigrants, her Grandfather came to the states from Scotland and her Grandmother from Germany. They met and were married in the United States after immigrating here back in the mid-late 1800's. My Mother served her country as the wife of a USAF soldier. While our Father was deployed away from home, she raised their 5 children and worked a full time job. After 21 years of service my Father decided to retire from the USAF and his Marriage. Leaving my Mother to raise their 2 youngest children.
Shortly there after she was diagnosed with deteriorating joint disease. The doctors were amazed that she was still able to walk as the disease was so advanced. Not only did she walk, but she worked until the day she passed away 3 years ago.
She worked a full time job, she volunteered at food banks and church dinners, helping those that were physically unable to go through the food line. She also volunteered doing whatever she could for our soldiers. She never married again. She was in constant pain but managed to pay her mortgage and provide for her children and her Mother.
She would never accept help from her older children, not that we didn't try. She never asked the state or federal government for help.
She taught us what she was taught growing up around her Grandparents. You NEVER ask for anything that you won't work hard for yourself. And work hard she did.
While I was home for a visit, we made a trip to Target. She often shopped there when they had sales on products because you could also use daily double coupons. While shopping on Saturday we ran across her neighbors, they were in line in front of us. They are in this country illegally. They live in a HUD home and pay $28.00 a month rent. There are 8 of them living in the home, 2 of which are children. All but 1 adult worked out of the home. Yet they were on welfare and food stamps. That day they spent in access of $800.00 for clothing, toys and beer. Then used their food stamp card for their food.
When we got back to the car, I realized that my Mother was upset and crying. I asked her what was wrong, she said what that family was doing was wrong. She said that so many of the people that came to the food bank where she volunteered really needed help, but for them, there was none. That the Seniors from the church dinners needed help and again there was none for them. But for this family that was in our Country illegally with 5 adults working , they were entitled to welfare? She could not understand how hard working Americans that were down on their luck and needed temp assistance, could get nothing, but these people who had no respect for the laws of our great nation was handed these things.
She never shed a tear for what she didn't have, but for those that she felt deserved help and couldn't get it.
I don't understand how it is okay for those here illegally to get the help that many American Citizens need and can not get. How is it that people that can afford to spend that much money on things such things as clothing, toys and beer... while Seniors can barely afford to feed themselves. Why do we Americans feel that we need to be provide for those that are here illegally and capable of working, while denying those that can not work because of disabilities just because they are Americans.
I have to ask you Mr Stossel, have you made the trip to the border towns in Arizona? My Sister lives there with the dangers everyday. A retired Naval sailor that loves her State and Country, fears walking out her door to go about her daily business. How is it okay for Americans to be forced to live in fear or leave their homes that they love?
It is so disheartening to read yet another story of how illegal aliens should be granted the same rights (or more rights) than law abiding American Citizens.
How is it fair to ask people like my Mother to support people that have no regards or respect for our laws?
If you really believe that Illegal aliens don't get welfare.... then you really should investigate. Maybe then we could get some real figures as to how many are really on public assistance.
While your at it, make a trip to some of the border towns post offices on welfare paydays.
Not only are we providing monthly checks to people in this country illegally, but to those that live in Mexico and come to the USA to pick up and cash their welfare checks one day each month.
We Americans fear what is headed our way. Free health care that is going to cost us more than we would probably ever use for ourselves in our life time. Amnesty, that could and probably will add to our welfare roles.
It is sad that we are asked on a daily basis from our own government to take food out of the mouths of our children to provide for those that are not suppose to be in America.
The frustration of having seen my Mother in pain and working is compounded when I see law breakers marching in the streets demanding of Americans rights that they don't deserve.
My Great Grandfather left Scotland for Canada on his way to America. When he got to Canada, he rented land and farmed it for 3 years until he was able to earn enough money to buy land in America. He and my Great Grandmother built (on their land) the only school in their little town and my Great Grandmother who was a teacher opened the doors to all the children that wished to come. They gave back to their community in many ways, but the Johnstone school was a remarkable thing for them to do. They were true immigrants, they loved this country and worked hard to repay her people for all the chance that they were given to be here. THEY NEVER EXPECTED ANYTHING FROM ANYONE.... They were true immigrants!

Re: Donna Very good post. However the problem is the welfare state offering freebies to anyone and everyone...not an immigration problem per se. Additionally the 14th amendment is outdated and misapplied; it sould be repealed. Infants born here to non citizens should not be granted citizenship. Steve

There is a simple solution to the illegal immigration situation. Allow immigrants one year to register as a guest worker. Perform a background check upon registration and issue a tamper proof ID card. Immigrant workers would then be in the open and entitled to the same protections as citizen workers. They would pay taxes and receive earned benefits accordingly.

After one year offer a $500 reward for reporting any immigrant working here without a permit and subsequently repatriated to their country of origin.

Immigrant workers should be offered no amnesty, no citizenship promise and no citizenship to babies born here.

It's the government's duty to stop illegal immigration. Anger towards employers and/or illegals is misplaced. The government should be held accountable for failing to protect the border and for providing (a magnet ) tax payer subsidized schooling, hospital care and other unearned benefits to illegals.



Steve Close Carpinteria, California

people need to remind every one that what concerns us all about the borders is our security. the ones posing a threat to our security are not the people coming just to work it is the drug dealers that are kidnapping people & murdering them & the potential for terrorists bringing in nuclear weapons that is the true threat. people need to keep their facts strait the large majority of those that come just to work do not want to be deported there for they stay as much under the Radar as possible they commit less crime then citizens and i would bet obey all the laws closer then the average citizen. the best way to resolve a large part of the problem is stay off illegal drugs teach your kids to stay off them & why. no drug addicts no drug dealers or just legalize drugs then they don't have to sneak them in. then make it easier for people to come & work (government!), just that would i would think would take care close to 99.9% of people coming making it more than possible for the rest of the threats to be controlled easily. problem solved! remember we are angry at the government for not doing their job in protecting us, not the people that just want a job.