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Blister Wonderful
I'm starting to have feelings for this guy friend I've been fooling around with, but I'm worried he isn't feeling the same way. He's stopped short of having full-blown intercourse with me, which I find odd, although I don't want to have sex yet because I have genital herpes and I'm not ready to tell him. (I take an antiviral drug for this daily, and I'd have him wear protection during intercourse.) Do you think he knows I have herpes? Maybe he just isn't interested in me romantically and doesn't want me getting too attached. — Puzzled
When you start to care about somebody, it's nice to give him little romantic gifts — flowers, a gourmet cupcake, a sweet card, weeping genital sores.
Surely you'd tell the guy pronto if you had a cold: "Hey, don't get too close, because you could catch this and have an unpleasant few days." But colds go away. Herpes is forever. Yeah, I know, so are diamonds. But, unlike a mammoth rock on a girl's finger, a big genital pustule isn't anything you want to be showing off to the crew at the office: "Look at it gleam under the fluorescents!"
Genital herpes hasn't always been such a big stigmatized deal — to the point where it's led to the tanking of countless potential relationships. Until the late '70s, it was seen as "cold sores down there" and often not even worthy of a visit to the doctor. Except in rare cases, the physical symptoms are relatively minor. At the first outbreak, especially, it feels a bit like the flu, with fever, headache, and muscle aches. There's also tingling and itching, and there can be pain, burning during urination (and don't forget the yucky sores!).
So, what led to all the stigma? The sexual revolution, for starters. In the mid-'70s, with lots of people having lots of sex, genital herpes spread (as probably did the common cold). In 1979, the CDC, seeing the herpes stats rising, got a little hysterical and announced an "epidemic" (of cold sores!), and the media ran with it. In 1980, Time magazine declared herpes "The New Sexual Leprosy," and in 1982, The Miami Herald called it a "cruel disease." "Cruel disease"? Multiple sclerosis is a cruel disease. But, an infection that gives you the itchies and makes you walk funny for a few days? As herpes simplex expert Dr. Adrian Mindel told The Independent in 1987, "For the majority of people herpes is ... nothing more than an occasional nuisance."
The thing is, if you're having an outbreak of your "occasional nuisance" and your naked parts are rubbing against somebody else's naked parts, you could infect him. The risk of transmission may be reduced by daily antiviral treatment and condom use — provided there are no contagious areas outside the condom zone. But, you can be in a contagious stage and not know it. Of the approximately 1 in 6 U.S. adults ages 14 to 48 who have genital herpes, 80 percent don't show visible symptoms, says herpes researcher Dr. Anna Wald. Research by Wald and her colleagues found that even when herpes carriers showed no symptoms, they were contagious 10 percent of the time. Of course, that's on average. Wald explained to me that there's a range: "Some people may be contagious 1 percent of the time, and others 30 percent, but we don't have a good way to predict who is who."
Putting this guy at risk for herpes without giving him any choice in the matter was not only unfair but pretty dumb. For many people, the betrayal is the biggest problem. If you tell somebody before he fools around with you and maybe pull a fact sheet off the Internet to allay his fears, he'll be less likely to ditch you, and he won't have the rage he would at being unwittingly exposed. To launch the conversation, maybe say something like "Ever gotten a cold sore? I get them sometimes...but not on my lip!" And then, as DatingWithHerpes.org advises, don't say "I have herpes," which makes you sound like you're having an outbreak right then. Instead, say "I carry the virus for herpes" and explain how often you have outbreaks...which should make it sound more like a manageable annoyance than the guy's ticket to a lifetime of Crusty Pustules Anonymous meetings.
NOTE: There are press reports, tracing back to the respected Herpes Viruses Association of the U.K., that drug company Burroughs Wellcome caused the initial stigmatization of people with herpes by marketing the stigma to sell its drug. The association could provide me no evidence supporting its accusation, nor could I find any in 51 years of newspaper and journal articles (from 1960 to 2011). I'm very much for going after drug companies for malfeasance, but not in the absence of evidence they've committed any.
Got a problem? Write Amy Alkon, 171 Pier Ave, #280, Santa Monica, CA 90405, or email AdviceAmy@aol.com (www.advicegoddess.com). Alkon is the author of "I See Rude People: One Woman's Battle To Beat Some Manners Into Impolite Society."
COPYRIGHT 2011 AMY ALKON
DISTRIBUTED BY CREATORS.COM
It's Advice Goddess Radio! Amy Alkon answers your questions on love, dating, sex, relationships, and manners. Listen live every Sunday from 7-8 p.m. Pacific time, or download the podcast at the link. The call-in number during the show is 347-326-9761. This week, Amy Alkon talks to Dr. Peter Jonason on the dark side of human mating — bad boys, booty calls, and the double standard.
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/amyalkon/2011/12/05/advice-goddess-radio-amy-alkon
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18 Comments | Post Comment
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Can I just say that, while this answer was pretty interesting and informative, it didn't answer the question? The LW never said she doesn't intend to tell the guy-in fact, what I got from it was that she's kind of glad he hasn't made the move yet because she knows when it's time she'll need to tell him and she's not ready. Problem is not the telling, it's that she wonders if he knows already. I say if he does all the better, bring it out in the open in the way that Amy suggests. Even though you may not love the timing, addressing it will keep him from wondering if you're planning on telling him or if you're a dishonest person. Since he hasn't run away, I'd say he either doesn't know and has his own hangups or really likes you and would be ok with it, but wonders if you're willing to lie about it and put him at risk or if you'll be honest. Say "I'm starting to feel like this could be getting serious, and there's something I think you should know before we go any further." If yo're starting to have feelings for him, now is the time, because he needs a chance to decide if this is something he can deal with before you start a real relationship, even if that deosn't include sex right away. The single good thing about STIs is that, assuming the person with the STD isn't morally bankrupt, it keeps people that would be on their way to the Maury Show in a year from having sex in the first place. They force the person with the disease to only sleep with someone they trust with their most personal truth, and makes the other person decide how much they care about this person before jumping in to bed. While I'd gladly eradicate STIs if I had a magic wand, I can't say that considering sex as a heavy decision tied to personal responsibility and committment to potentially making sacrifices to be together a bad thing. I just wish we could revert back to "before I have sex with you, I need to decide if I want to marry you" rather than "before I have sex with you, I need to decide if I'm willing to be exposed to herpes for you."
Comment: #1
Posted by: Nichole
Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:56 AM
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LW1: I think you should just ask him. You're willing to have sex with a guy you can't talk to? Tell him you've noticed that he pulls back and you're wondering why.
Comment: #2
Posted by: Diana
Tue Dec 20, 2011 12:57 PM
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@Nichole -- I'm nodding my head in agreement. Amy's "answer" was interesting and informative but didn't actually answer the question. That's because Amy had an agenda that she wanted to preach that didn't REALLY relate back to the actual question asked. Frankly, I'm not sure I believe that herpes was ever not that big of a deal -- pretty sure that just about ANY STD, or, in fact, anything that would indicate a person (a woman, certainly) was having sex out of wedlock and/or was promiscuous, was a big, fat, hairy deal before the sexual revolution. But, as I was a mere child during the sexual revolution (born in 1971), perhaps I am wrong about this.
And I also agree with you wholeheartedly that it sure would be nice if people would actually take sex (be it "just fooling around" or actual intercourse) a little more seriously.
LW1 -- This is going to sound really judgmental, and I honestly do not mean for it to be, but since you CLEARLY haven't already figured this out, I feel like I'm going to have to beat you over the head with it. Your problem isn't herpes, nor is it whether or not this guy already knows you have herpes. Your problem is that you appear to be willing to have sex (or just fool around) with men BEFORE you have taken the time to really get to know them, BEFORE you have allowed feelings for them to develop, BEFORE you have had time to figure out how they feel about you and BEFORE you have established a real, trusting relationship. Has it ever occurred to you that perhaps you wouldn't have herpes right now if you had a real, trusting, loving relationship with the guy who gave it to you? Yes, herpes can be transmitted even when everyone's been upfront about the risk and taken precautions to mitigate that risk -- but I'm willing to bet that's not the most common scenario, and I'm willing to bet that's not what happened with you. If it was, then I apologize for making that assumption.
But again, the point isn't that you have herpes. The point is that you are not acting like a mature, responsible adult. There isn't an advice columnist on Earth (or anyone else, for that matter) who can tell you whether this guy knows that you have herpes or whether he's just not that into you. There is only ONE person who can -- THE GUY IN QUESTION! So grow up and have a grown-up conversation with him.
And in future, consider that it's just possible that the whole old-fashioned, out-dated notion of getting to know someone and establishing a real relationship with someone BEFORE becoming physically intimate with him might just be a good idea!
My rule of thumb that I like to tell teenagers and young adults (because I mentor young college women): if you're not adult enough to talk with someone about sex, you're not adult enough to HAVE sex. Similarly, if you're not comfortable enough with someone and your relationship with that someone to talk about it, you aren't ready for it.
Comment: #3
Posted by: Lisa
Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:48 PM
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@Diana -- I should have read your post before writing mine. Took me way too long to say what you said in a few sentences. I was too busy preaching!
Comment: #4
Posted by: Lisa
Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:49 PM
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There are single clubs for those with Herpes. I do not know where to findthem, but, I am sure the NET will have mucho info on it. That way, finding someone from these groups will never get you in trouble.
Comment: #5
Posted by: Melanie
Tue Dec 20, 2011 2:52 PM
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My friend who has herpes relayed to me something the doctor said to her (no, I don't have the disease, to my knowledge, but I found it interesting anyway).
If you have herpes and take your antiviral medication regularly and correctly, you'll only be contagious, on average, one day out of every year, whether you have symptoms or not.
The problem is, there's no way to know for sure which day of the year that will be.
Whether that's an acceptable risk to take with your partner has to be your personal choice.
Comment: #6
Posted by: Paul W
Tue Dec 20, 2011 2:58 PM
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Shouldn't the choice be HIS? It IS a disease. it IS permanent. It WILL affect him from time to time for the rest of his life should he catch it. YES you should tell him!!! Then he can decide if sex with you is worth it. How ticked off is he going to be if he finds out AFTER you guys have sex? The first thing he's going to think is how little you actually CARE about him. How did you get herpes anyway? Did you know beforehand and choose to have sex anyway or did it come as a "surprise" afterward? Think about someone other than yourself! You have no right to make this choice for him.
Comment: #7
Posted by: Jess
Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:17 AM
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@Jess -- reread the letter and you will see that she is glad he hasn't pushed for intercourse (they're just "fooling around" at this point, which I assume means some sort of "everything but actual sex" scenario) because she doesn't want to have sex with him yet BECAUSE SHE'S NOT READY TO TELL HIM YET. In other words, she has every intention of telling him first. Her question wasn't "do I have to tell him about my herpes?" Her question was, given that they've been "fooling around" but haven't had sexual intercourse, she is wondering what it means that the man in question hasn't pushed for "the real deal." Does it mean he knows about the herpes and just hasn't said anything to her about it? (I think this is highly unlikely, BTW -- if he knew about it, unless he is well-educated about herpes, he probably wouldn't even be fooling around with her without first asking her more about it) Or does it mean something else entirely? That's what she's asking.
But yes, the choice has to be made by the one who is at risk of contracting the disease (which can only be made if the disease has been disclosed).
Comment: #8
Posted by: Lisa
Wed Dec 21, 2011 6:43 AM
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Re: Lisa,
Yeah, I read and re-read it. HE stopped them from having intercourse, which she found odd. SHE did not stop him but she was glad HE STOPPED because, really, she's not sure if she's ready. If HE had NOT stopped the sex, it would already have happened. She doesn't seem to have the wherewithal to stop it herself. Not a real stellar situation as it could have already been too late for the guy. What we have here is an insecure twit with a contagious disease who really should stop " fooling around" until she's mature enough or just plain caring enough about other human beings to develop a relationship before putting others at risk.
Comment: #9
Posted by: Jess
Wed Dec 21, 2011 11:57 AM
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@Jess -- as you probably already know from my initial post, I actually agree with you that (at best) she's not being a mature, responsible adult (because I believe mature, responsible adults figure out their feelings and get to know each other and establish a real, trusting relationship FIRST and THEN they get physically intimate, not the other way around -- and similarly, and much more importantly, they would be open and honest with each other about any communicable diseases well before they were in the heat of the moment). And you are right -- he's the one who's been stopping them, so there's no telling for sure that she would stop if he made the move toward intercourse.
I really was only pointing out that her question wasn't "do I have to tell him I have herpes" or even "how do I tell him, " or even "when do I tell him." Ironically enough, that's what is even scarier about her letter, is what it IS NOT about. She's all hung up on "why doesn't he want to have sex with me," instead of focusing on some of the much bigger issues at stake here. Because again, as you pointed out, no matter how "minor" the actual symptoms may be (and I am sure that varies from person to person, and probably even from outbreak to outbreak on the same person), it's still something you're stuck with forever. This isn't like giving someone a cold.
Comment: #10
Posted by: Lisa
Wed Dec 21, 2011 12:18 PM
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Well, they have dating sites for people who have STDs. She should drop this guy so she does not infect him and sign up on an STD dating site for people with her STD. this way she won't have to worry about infecting some unsuspecting guy.
Comment: #11
Posted by: David
Wed Dec 21, 2011 1:49 PM
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I don't know how he would know unless he's a mind reader... Very informative answer from Amy on how to inform the potential partner without making him/her have an instant anxiety attack, but the crux of the matter in this specific case is, she doesn't know if he's really interested or why he seemeed to be shying away from "going all the way"... AND she seems to be gun-shy about disclosure although she has no problem with hanky-panky. Hm.
Well, considering the two of them have been fooling around already, methinks the "Ever gotten a cold sore? I get them sometimes...but not on my lip!" approach is quite urgent. Never mind that she doesn't seem to be "ready" to tell him, if she is ready to open up her legs, then she has to make herself ready to lower the boom, otherwise she's being a b*tch. If he runs for the hills after that, she'll know he bought into the media-generated hysteria - it really IS nothing but a cold sore "down there".
It would be too bad, but better before than after she's unwittingly/neglectingly infected him... People with this 'cold sore down there" can be contagious even without being in the throes of an attack, especially if they DON'T take the proper medication (what Paul said). Bummer. Unfortunately, I get the impression that the LW is more interesting in f*cking than telling. Much worse bummer. Thank God she only has herpes.
If he does freak out and runs away screaming, I suggest one of the dating websites for herpes-positive people. When you both have it, hey, what the heck...
@Lisa
Let's not jump to conclusions here. Perhaps she got it from an unsavory one-night-stand, perhaps she got it from a man she loved and trusted.
@Diana
Right on!
Comment: #12
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Wed Dec 21, 2011 8:38 PM
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I agree that the LW needs to talk to the guy about it, but it wouldn't be an easy conversation to have no matter how close you are to someone, so I don't think Diana's comment about being willing to have sex with a guy you can't talk to is fair. Diana also said to "Tell him you've noticed that he pulls back and you're wondering why." That would probably make him think she was trying to hide it from him. She should tell him, and if he knew already he may tell her so.
And where does Lise get that she is "ready to open her legs" without telling him? She specifically says "I don't want to have sex yet". That sure doesn't sound like "ready to open her legs." And whatever extent the fooling around to goes to, it apparently isn't far enough to give the guy herpes, or they might as well be "going all the way", but she doesn't want to for fear of infecting him.
Comment: #13
Posted by: C Meier
Thu Dec 22, 2011 6:00 PM
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@Lisa
You said "Similarly, if you're not comfortable enough with someone and your relationship with that someone to talk about it, you aren't ready for it."
That's exactly what the LW is saying. She's not ready to tell him, so she doesn't want to have sex yet. You yourself point that out in your response to Jesss, and I quote "she doesn't want to have sex with him yet BECAUSE SHE'S NOT READY TO TELL HIM YET."
You have no idea how far the "fooling around" goes. There's way to much sex on the third date these days, but I don't think there's anything wrong with some making out if you like each other but aren't in a relationship. That's not "physically intimate", which you say they are without any clear knowledge of that. And she DOES know him - he is a friend, so this isn't even just a dated a few times senario.
Also in your response to Jess, you say "And you are right -- he's the one who's been stopping them, so there's no telling for sure that she would stop if he made the move toward intercourse." Yes, we can tell, because she says "I DON"T WANT TO HAVE SEX YET". How much clearer to you want it?
I think that the LW is being responsible by not wanting to have sex until she is ready to tell him (meaning she IS comfortable in the relationship). I don't understand why everybody is assuming she is such a bad person.
I've gotten "incorrect capcha" 4 times already, so sorry is there are multiple posts of this.
Comment: #14
Posted by: C Meier
Thu Dec 22, 2011 6:59 PM
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Re: C Meier
"He's stopped short of having full-blown intercourse with me"
This is where I'm getting it from. Granted she also says she's not ready to have sex yet, but not enough to be the one stopping the procedures, apparently. She may not be ready to tell him but she certainly was ready to have sex if she's all puzzled that he was the one to pull away. The fact is, HE is the one who pulled away, not her and, like Jess said, if he hadn't, they WOULD have had sex, for all that she's so very "reluctant".
Personally, although I don't have it myself and I'm sure it's worse for some people than from others, I believe it IS nothing but a "cold sore down there", that way too much hoo-doo is being done over this the minute it's on the parts rather than anywhere else on the body and, if I cared truly about a man, I would be willing to chance the one-day-a-year loto if he takes the proper medication. If I'm informed, that is. Any herpetic man who would have sex with me without informing me forst and that would be a deal-breaker - whether he gave it to me or not. It's not a question of being herpetic, it's a question of being responsible and trustworthy.
So it's not so much the herpes that I'm slamming her about, it's her cavalier attitude with being willing to, yes, open up her legs, if only because she doesn't have the werewithal to say no herself, with the guy she might infect not being in a position to take a consenting decision.
P.S.: Some fooling around is steamier than others. If it involves oral sex, then yes, she could give it to him that way.
P.P.S.: Did you know you can give it to yourself? If you have the lip variety, touch your lips and then touch your parts and your next outbreak just might be "'down there".
Comment: #15
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Sat Dec 24, 2011 4:14 PM
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Drop they guy and find one who already is infected. There are singles dating sites especially for those with herpes. I do not know exactly where to find them-----but, search the NET. I do know there are such singles dating groups as there was a guy at our church, who announced he had herpes and felt it unwise to date anyone without it. He did all of his dating thru such a group.
Comment: #16
Posted by: Darcie
Sun Dec 25, 2011 5:33 AM
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as a carrier of the herpes virus, i will tell you my story:
i was in a 6 month committed relationship with my now-husband of 22 wonderful, happy years. one day, out of the blue, i felt very sick... and had a HORRENDOUSLY painful group of lesions "down there". there was nothing mild about it. walk FUNNY? uh, no. could barely walk at all. where did i get it? from him. i had had no sex with anyone else for well over six months. my doc discovered that now-hubby was a carrier although he had never had an outbreak, EVER. he had been married to a druggie/alcoholic who, well... she gave it to him.
we loved each other so much (and still do!) that we trusted that neither had been with someone else.
i can tell you that my flare-ups were NOT mild, they were not "just a cold sore down there"....but they did grow fewer and fewer as the years went by. i seldom have one now unless i'm REALLY stressed out (stress can cause flare-ups) and even then, it's barely noticeable nowadays. so, while it IS forever, it does decrease in strength and number over the years.
as i read this LW's letter, i actually got angry. she should not be "fooling around" with him AT ALL because she hasn't told him. if she's not ready to tell him, as she states, then she should not be leading him on with the "fooling around" because they may not be able to stop once they get started. and what really made me angry was that she's not so much worried about the herpes as she is wondering about why HE'S pulling back?? what is WRONG with this chick? if you're NOT READY FOR SEX because you're NOT READY TO TELL HIM, then DON'T "FOOL AROUND"! she is ASKING for trouble of the worst kind. what if they go all the way because he doesn't "pull back" this time and he gets infected.... because SHE can't "pull back" and stop him? OMG.
i wonder how she'll feel when she infects him and he puts the word out (on facebook or wherever) that she's DISEASED... so DON'T get near her! would serve her right.
sorry. i have this disease through no fault of my own... or even my husband's. i have some pretty strong feelings about appropriate behavior when you DO know you have it... and behave like this LW.
Comment: #17
Posted by: Catherine E
Wed Dec 28, 2011 5:15 PM
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btw, i should add that i suffered miserably with this disease for about 5 years. it was NO fun. hubby has never had one outbreak. go figure. he felt SO bad since he was the one who infected me and had to watch me suffer. after about the 20th outbreak, he felt so bad and so helpless that he cried in my arms . thankfully, after those bad years went by, it was much easier for both of us.
this disease is no joke.
Comment: #18
Posted by: Catherine E
Wed Dec 28, 2011 11:15 PM
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