Annie's Mailbox® by Kathy Mitchell and Marcy Sugar

LW1 - I laughed when I read that your in laws make a 5 year old sit next to them on a couch for an entire visit. They may favor her, but she won't favor them because sitting next to old people for any length of time is boring for most 5 year olds. However, since your hubby is totally useless, it's up to you as the mom to lay down the law to these people & let them know that unless they treat the kids equally, they won't see either one. Let them know you will return or confiscate any gifts you feel are inappropriate, and inappropriate includes unequal. It is up to you to control how much time you spend with people, esp if you have to drive any length of time to get there. You don't have to justify your reasons for declining an invitation. If you tell them your kids get carsick, they are likely to make you prove that or argue about it. Just thank them for the invitation and tell them you are sorry, but that doesn't work for you. Traveling and having out of town company every 2 weeks would make me crazy, but ymmv. I wouldn't worry about ruining your relationship. You have control of the kids so you hold a lot of power.
LW2 - suggest you contact the veterans administration and see if they can help you at all. Look at the list of offices in your county government & call one that provides elder services. They might have an idea or know who to call.

LW1 - "it is damaging the relationship they have with both girls (as well as their parents)." The favoritism is also damaging to the relationship between the two girls. My mother showed a lot of favoritism to my older child. I found that my father, my husband and I were giving more attention to my younger child to compensate. And then I realized that meant that we were giving less attention to the older child and it was causing a rift and behavior problems. My youngest is still 1, but I stopped allowing visits. My parents are toxic for a long list of other reasons but the favoritism was already causing a lot of problems and I wanted to end it before the younger one could figure out what was going on. I don't want my kids to grow up hating each other because they were pitted against each other and had to compete for attention.

LW2 - In National Cemeteries, spouses can be buried in the same plot as the veteran. Before the first burial, the cemetery needs to know there will be another, because these burials are not side-by-side, but stacked, so the grave must be made deeper to accomodate two. Also, some national cemeteries are closing to casket burials die to lack of space, but still accept cremains, which are much less expensive. Even if you are buried in a non-national cemetery, the VA will provide a suitable headstone or other marker, free of charge.
I would STRONGLY suggest that you get in touch with Veterans Affairs to discuss your situation NOW. They may have a solution to your plight that no one else has brought up.

LW2 - In National Cemeteries, spouses can be buried in the same plot as the veteran. Before the first burial, the cemetery needs to know there will be another, because these burials are not side-by-side, but stacked, so the grave must be made deeper to accomodate two. Also, some national cemeteries are closing to casket burials die to lack of space, but still accept cremains, which are much less expensive. Even if you are buried in a non-national cemetery, the VA will provide a suitable headstone or other marker, free of charge.

I would STRONGLY suggest that you get in touch with Veterans Affairs to discuss your situation NOW. They may have a solution to your plight that no one else has brought up.

LW1-
Children who are pitted against each other to compete for attention grow up with lifelong problems, because this creates a pattern they apply to every relationship. And as FAW illustrated, even when other adults try to compensate, it merely creates TWO lopsided situations instead of one.

The grandparents are behaving like hungry predators - they are demanding the exclusive attention of the eldest, as if she couldn't possibly be interested in anything else but them, they are creating a pattern of injustice the younger one will start figuring out very soon, and they are encouraging both children to be rude because they want their attention to be focused solely on their precious selves. They also don't care what these constant visits impose on them (car sickness) and on you, treating you as if you were nothing but the car transportation to bring them their toy at their beck and call. In other words, they are being extremely demanding and selfish.

Hubby doesn't like to make waves? Oh, poor baby, I feel so sorry for his predicament. I would suggest that he finally
finds his balls under the remnants of the umbilical cord if he doesn't want to end up losing the respect of both his daughters and his wife. Which is eventually what is going to happen if you continue to be always pegged in the role of the bad cop, with Mister Jello Spine just sitting pretty trying to avoid trouble.

I wouldn't worry about "ruining your relationship" with them. As kai archie pointed out, you have the bigger end of the stick here. Don't relinquish your authority, especially in the matter of favouritism - kai archie said it perfectly. And if this "ruins" the relationship with them, better that than ruining the GIRLS' every future relationship with others. These children are not toys for their amusement. The fact is, as FAW illustrated, if they start waging a war on you over this, you may have to stop the visits altogether.

My kids love their grandmother (my MIL) but also know she can be difficult. They are always respectful to her, but when they were 4 and 7, the little one got her good.

My MIL was visiting that day and she decided she would spend the morning playing with the elder girl, who would be leaving for a b-day party, and then play with the younger one while the elder was out. The younger wanted to join the play, but my MIL told her, "No, I will play with you LATER."

Well, when later came around, my younger one was occupied on a computer learning game as my MIL said, "Now that your sister has gone to her party, I will play with you." To which my younger one said (remember, she was 4 at the time), "Maybe later, I'm busy right now."

And I refused to intervene. My face said it all to my MIL. "You will respect her answer and I will NOT MAKE her play with you at YOUR convenience."

As the parent, especially as the mother, stand up for your kids and empower them to stand up for themselves.

LW1: I can relate....my in-laws were like that too, luckily it has gotten a lot better. It was quite bad for a while as they are the only grandchildren they will ever have, so it was not pretty. They were very dissappointed (at first at least) that we did not have a boy (2 girls) and were quite vocal about it to my husband, which did not endear me to them. We saw them every 2 weeks in the beginning too, 2.5 hour drive, though they came to us most times as traveling with kids is involved, at least it sure seemed that way, taking the food trays, bowls, baby food, formula, toys, blankets, etc. Mine favor my younger daughter more (now). My older daughter notices and it hurts her feelings. I have told my DH they need to be conscious of that and they have gotten better. So it should get better, as they have gotten older the less we see them as it is still hard for us to visit them as my kids are busy with school, clubs, dance, girl scouts, and just about every weekend we are doing something, when we have nothing going on then I insist we have a quiet weekend. So our visits are now about every 3 months. I see my family only 2 x a year (4 hours a way), though it used to be a lot more when my mom was alive, but that is another can of worms.
LW2: As mentioned above, your spouse can be buried at a VA cemetary as well as yourself, I believe for free. My in-laws are planning to do that, or at least my FIL is, and I presume my MIL will be buried there too, presuming my FIL pre-deceases my MIL that is. The y had a friend whose wife died (before he did) and she is buried in a vetrans cemetary though she never served, she was married to a veteran. I believe it is all done for no charge, but I could be wrong about that of course. Call the appropriote VA office and see what you need to do to get this set up so when the time comes you or your wife know what to do.

LW1 - Favoritism... oy. I guess some family members really never get it do they?

After being the black sheep in my family, watching my side of the family disfavor my daughter similarly, and then watching my ILs favor my son against my nephews, I'm a huge advocate for doing whatever is necessary to put a stop to such behavior. If that's up to and including terminating visits because it's causing so much damage to the kids, then so be it.

My son has never met my parents - he was born a couple years after I cut off contact with them, and I refuse to expose him to their dysfunctional garbage. After my ILs had their own "flesh and blood" grandchildren they dropped their interest in my daughter like a hot rock. They tell their friends they only have three grandchildren - my son and two nephews. I say screw them all, it's their loss.

If one wonders whether cutting off visits is cruel to the grandparents, ask yourself what's real cruelty - putting your foot down against them when enough is enough, or seeing your disfavored kids' hearts get stomped on at every visit (or seeing other relative's kids get hurt that way because your child's been favored).

Some might argue that it is what it is, family members aren't perfect, and life's not fair... okay, but the real world will have enough of its lessons to offer in that regard. Why allow those who are supposed to be closest and most loving to your children inflict emotional harm? IMHO a family should be a safe haven and that's also where children first learn how to treat others. Teach them favoritism, or allow relatives to play favorites with them, and one day they'll do it to their own grandkids.

kids aren't stupid - Oh, snap! I love it! Good for your daughter on setting her own boundaries with Grandma, and good on you for supporting her. I agree that our kids are a lot more perceptive than we give them credit for - my daughter stopped asking to see my parents as much the past few years and my son still talks about how mean my MIL is even though he hasn't seen her in over a year and a half.

LW2 - Sue in La is correct.

LW3 - Nicely said. Thank you for sharing that. It does get better after high school... it doesn't mean some people won't stop acting as if they're 14 year olds in an adult's body but at least they're easier to weed out of your life as you get older.

@rusty -- if you're out there today, I left a message for you on yesterday's thread about Catholicism.

@ The Annies -- As usual, your advice was good -- as far as it went. I would caution the mother to be careful about making any promises related to DAILY interaction via FaceTime, Tango, etc. For one thing, daily is a big time commitment. For another, the grandparents are equally capable of playing favorites over the phone or over the Internet. LW1's issue isn't simply that it's a hassle to travel, it's that the grandparents' favoritism is toxic. You tell the LW to "bring the favoritism to their attention" -- but you don't offer practical advice about how to do this. If LW is really, really lucky, she can just say, "you probably don't even realize you're doing it, but you favor our eldest, and the youngest is getting to an age where she is going to notice this and be hurt by it" -- and then, magically, the grandparents will tidily agree to mend their ways and do it. Given that they get upset when the LW has tried to establish other boundaries, I don't know why you think that is going to work. You also don't address the spineless wonder of a husband and father. You don't think LW1 should have a serious conversation with him about his duty to his daughters, that he owes it to them to grow a backbone, pronto?

LW1 -- you have gotten excellent advice here at the BTL. Children grow up just fine without grandparents, so if you end up having to cut them off, don't worry about it overmuch. I don't generally advocate using kids as pawns in a parental chess match, but in this case, it certainly is true that you have the kids, therefore you have all the power. Stand your ground on how often visits occur (if at all), tell the grandparents that if they cannot treat the children fairly, they don't get to see them, tell your husband to get some assertiveness training or something, because his daughters need him.

The Annies' advice to LW1 is a little problematic. If she tells her in-laws, "We'd love to visit again, but the girls get so sick when they travel" the in-laws will drive right over, and will volunteer to drive over every week for the next 20 years. If you protest how much gas that's costing them, they'll move next door. You need to be direct without being unpleasant. If the MIL causes a stink, let her.... you can't change how other people act or feel.
I'd say don't make excuses, and don't be argumentative. When the in-laws invite you to visit in two weeks, just say directly and with a smile, "We can't do that, but we can make the trip in June --- will that work for you guys?" If you give little excuses for "why" you can't make the trip, you're leaving yourselves vulnerable. Just say you can't do it and offer an alternative date (weeks or months away) with a smile.

LW 2: I am sure this was a written snail mail letter, considering he listed all he does not have. Hopefully he can see our answers or Annies can print them as suggestions in the newspapers.

You don't need to think NATIONAL CEMETERIES.

FIRST AND MOST IMPORTANT--call your local Veteran's Service Officer. He will help you from now till death. My dad died in another state, we have his headstone and my mom's as one HERE. The VSO got his FEDERALLY SUPPLIED grave marker sent here to the funeral home which went and applied it for us--with 6 weeks of his death. My mom had been dealing with the VSO from her town/state and I did here. They help you look for benefits, put things together, can also be or find you a guarian ad litem from the court which will help oversee your final wishes.
If you go this route, alot of things are taken care of.


If making choices on your own, check with your local city cemetery people--at your city office/municipal building. Ours has a special place for veterans who have no 'final resting place'. Our small town cemetery has soldiers in it from the civil war and on. Our county cemetery boards put the veterans in the forefront of final resting.
Also to be in the loop should be the local human services office. These places work together.

The suggestion of donation of bodies to the medical research, etc. HAS IMPLICATIONS you must understand. Contact your own state medical school. My dad thought about this as well. He told many of his before his death, I was the only one who went and did the research of the process. Your state DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH will help you. Lots of pages and pages of paperwork.

1. The body must be transported to a refridgerated holding place and it has to be completed within a 2 hour time frame. Last breath to being on the table is 2 hours. YOU have to do the paper work done ahead of time.

2. You have to sign off in agreement of body disposal. Usual time of body study is 2 years. Then they dispose by cremation and ashed put into unmarked area on the medical school property. They get too many to have a nice plan to take care of expense. If you have a family plot, etc and want the loved one afterwards-- YOU are responsible for the cost of cremation, the pickup of the cremains and then home or where ever you choose. And the ashes are in a cardboard container, unless pre-arranged.

3. Contra-indicators for NOT taking the body for science comes up too. If cancer or certain diseases of study get their pick. If you are generally an older person readying yourself for death, they can refuse you. If there is any contamination or isolation due to reason of death, you can also be refused.

If in your final days you can get yourself CLOSE proximity to be within the guidelines of time and distance, that works even better.

There is no dumping of bodies--persey. If you have not done all the legal stuff ahead of time, your body will go back to your local county to make decisions of what happens. Some larger counties have a morgue full of unclaimed bodies--if part of a police case, they keep them as longer. Otherwise, a general cremation of several bodies and then disposal.


For me, this sounded outside of my beliefs of what I could accept. The doctor of the hospital where my dad was--1 mile from home--took the information, took my dad's requests and then verified what I had researched. So the family wanted what dad's wishes but since he lived 3 weeks longer, the conversation was able to be brought up. As it was, my mom put my dad to bed, tucked him in--he was adamat about coming to be in my town that night. She told him they would talk about it in the morning, as it was dark and cold out. She went to bed--the first time in her own bed that night rather than the couch near dad--and woke 3 hours later and found him gone. His spirit had made the trip and the 2 hour time frame was no ones issue. They said time of death was shortly after he was tucked in for the night, nice, cozy, warm.

My mom had been struggling with the whole medical school thing, but was accepting his desire for cremation. But that this point she said cremation was after the funeral, people of the community wanted to pay respects and see him one last time. He looked great--funeral director did an awesome job. Since he was a well known business person who retired and went full time cowboy, he had many friends in many areas. Including many people's children who's lives you share--when you are the rancher/cowboy. Many children with parents at the funeral.
(It is easier to explain death to your kids when they are younger and the person is not mom/dad/grandparents/siblings. You can answer questions easier without the grieving process that would be there if your own tight family circle.)

Good thing you can't see me posting--the tears are flowing as I type. Today was my little brother's birthday--he died 2007, and we would have had a big party at his group home. So I sit with my memories of both dad and Alan. You can bet they are doing something together as buddies in heaven.

GUARDIAN AD LITEM is what it should state. Sorry.

Dear Annie,

My wife read the article Wife Feels Like Servant and feels most of these were our problems as well? Please let me give you some background information first.

We have been married over 42 years and my wife is planning to retire at the end of this year. I am unemployed/retired but can't find a job. She leaves the house every morning at nine and returns at seven. I go grocery shopping every Monday plus by seven at night time I will have dinner ready for us on Monday thru Wednesday. Thursday/Friday we will go out to eat.

It's hands OFF on the laundry, washing/wiping of any dishes, don't clean the hardwood floors or vacuum the rugs, NO dusting/polishing and leave the bathrooms alone.

It's her way and NO way else.

The house is spotless and when our friends come in they comment on this.

I ask her all the time what she want's me to do? I am suppose to know what is to be done after all these years. I didn't think I was a mind reader? Please leave me a note and the answer is NO.

One step my wife did to solve this problem is sleep by herself???

Please could you help me with this?

Thank You very much,

Jerry

Re: L
They "were quite vocal about it" to your husband? What did they expect him to do about it, have you beheaded as if they were Henry the VIII? OFF WITH HER HEAD, yells the Queen of Hearts. She's all heart, now isn't she.

Interesting that they would blame you for that, even though it's the sperm of the man that determines the gender of the baby. Forget technology, information highways and university educations, people still think the same as they did when kings would put their queen away for not having sons. And people call me paranoid when I said mentalities have not changed. Yrrrch.

@jerry alter -- I suspect you really intended to send your message to the Annies, not to the BTL (commenters Below The Line). But the BTL is where you landed, so...

I can certainly understand why you are frustrated, as it sounds like you are willing to take on more of the household chores but are not being given a chance to do them because your wife doesn't trust you to do them the "right way" -- the "right way" being "her way." I know I have sometimes done this to my husband, where he offers to do something for me, and then I tell him not to do it, because I know he won't do it right. Now, there's a difference between something that really is "wrong" and something that is simply "different," and I try to keep that in mind and let him do stuff "his way" if it's really not something that is "wrong." For example, if he puts the toiletpaper on the roll the opposite way I do, that's not "wrong" that's just "different," and I can live with it. On the other hand, if he uses the wrong cleanser on our stovetop, he could ruin the stove, and then we would need a new one -- that's not just "different," that's "wrong."

Your wife may or may not be able to learn that difference and then let you act accordingly. But in the meantime, I also have to ask you -- have you ever asked her what her reasons are for doing things a certain way? While she may need to learn to be a bit more flexible on things, is it possible that every time you have tried to do one of these tasks, you have ended up doing real damage and/or she winds up just having to re-do it herself later? If so, perhaps you can understand her frustration?

On the surface, you asking for a list of things you can do to help her sounds like a good, sensible idea, and her response -- that you should know what needs to be done sounds unreasonable. And yet...if, after 42 years of living in that house with her you cannot identify what needs to be done and how to do it -- can you understand why she might be frustrated by that? No one has to tell her when there's dirty laundry, when the bathrooms need to be cleaned, when stuff that has piled up needs to be put away, etc. She just sees the laundry and knows it needs to be washed (or knows that it's not a full load and can wait another day or two). She knows when the last time was the bathrooms were cleaned and therefore knows when they need to be cleaned again. She sees stuff has piled up, and she puts it away. So, when you ask her to leave a list, she's thinking to herself, "really, you're a big boy, after 42 years you can't figure this out?"

Tell her you want to learn how to do this stuff properly so that you can help out more. Perhaps, as she is teaching you how she wants stuff done, she will realize that some of this stuff doesn't have to be done "her way" and you'll be able to help her out with that stuff. And perhaps you will see that she has good reason for doing things a certain way, and you will learn "her way" to do it so that you will be able to help her out with that stuff.

Dear Annie; I have an older relative who is constantly drinking; has a violent temper, and is planning to kill me. What should I do? Not to mention the fact that her manners are very horrible; she steals my phone calls by grabbing the phone when ever it rings, insisting that the phone call is the one she's been waiting for..It was actually an important phone call for me and she never let me take the call so now I have to wait for them to call back. Next, she condescendingly screams at me to stay out of the bathroom for a sick relative who has the flu, as if I wouldn't know the boundaries of polite behavior already; I told her, "I know that already, thank you very much, but I don't need to be told, ordered around, or condescended too." She hissed imperiously at me , "you know what YOU'RE A STUPID GIRL!".

Can you tell me how to deal with a truculent relative who is imperiously carping at me in an all out bullying-manners-war. I know that I am not an ignorant person; how can I get my older relative who depends on everyone so much and can not do anything, not even back out the car without help from someone that I am not to be called stupid and imperiously bullied in an all out manners war? Please help. Thanks, Miss Nancy

Re: jerry alter

As Lisa said, you are in the commentary here, which the Annies don't bother to read (they should) and certainly never answer.

Further to what Lisa already said, if your wife refuses to let you do certain chores because only her way is right, then you should ask her to teach you the "right" way. Whatever your ignorance about such matters makes you, if you don't know, then you don't know, and if she adamantly refuses to train you, then she shouldn't complain about the extra workload. And you can tell her I said so.

LW1--"I have two daughters, ages 5 and 2. My in-laws favor the older girl." Your in-laws appear to favor the older girl with regards to gifts and attention because she's the first grandchild, she's 5 and probably much more fun at that age than the younger, "terrible" 2 year old. As for your in-laws other pushy behaviors, I agree with the Annies in that it's an issue of boundaries rather than favoritism. When your in-laws become annoyed by your insistence that your girls introduce themselves to their hosts before playing with presents, you simply tell them what you told the Annies: "I think it's only polite." Then brush them off. When your in-laws act affronted when you don't subject your girls to car sickness for three hours just to visit them, you similarly inform them of the facts. Again, then brush them off. You need to gently, yet firmly assert yourself as the parent and therefore the one in charge of your girls' welfare. Beyond you and your husband, there is no higher authority and your in-laws need to understand that. You also need to entreaty your husband to be your partner in this and he should be prepared and committed to stepping in when his family goes overboard.

LW2--"What can we do to make minimal preparations for our inevitable demise?" Personally, why do you care? Once you're dead, you'll be well beyond caring one whit about what happens to your body or where your final resting place is. Since you have no children or assets to speak of, nobody else will care either. It's just a discarded body; treat it accordingly.

LW3--"Gaze in the mirror every morning and find that beauty in you, and don't let anyone take it away." Amen! You go girrrl! I too was an overweight and awkward child. Once I went off to college and began a new lifestyle of healthy living, eating right and working out with weights I am in the best shape of my life. I too look back on high school and laugh at the bullies to thought they could break me. I once ran into one of them when I was visiting family for the holidays and he didn't even recognize me. Meanwhile, he had morphed from a fit sports star into an overweight, middle-aged has-been. Now that tasted sweet! Life is for you. Live it and love yourself!

My husband was an ordained minister, Chaplain for VFW Post 9439 in Casper WY, and WY State American Legion Chaplain. He served on the Natrona County Veteran's Service Council that provides Military Rites at Veteran's furnerals at the State Veteran's Cemetary Chapel at Evansville; also graveside rites at other cemetaries, churches, funeral homes and other venues. He presided at many veterans funerals whether there was an honorarium or not as he felt it was the last honor he could give his fellow serviceman. He was one of nine who survived a battle and came home. It was always difficult for him to understand and accept- why me? Given the age of this couple I surmise he is a Korean War Veteran as was my husband. Others have posted very good information on this subject. It would be helpful to contact the nearest VFW and or American Legion Post in his area. Both have auxilliaries for spouses. There are veterans groups in many places that meet for coffee, visit and reminisce. They sound as if they are alone and lonely. That doesn't have to be if they will just reach out. Check the phonebook for vets organizations. I pray that they willl act soon while their health allows. My husband died in June 2004, just 20 days after being diagnosed with leukemia. It has been a lonely time since his death as we were best friends for nearly 50 years. I have 3 children and 4 grandchildren but there is a void in my life they cannot fill.

Re: nancy
Again, you are in the commentary here, so if it's really the Annies you want, you are in the wrong place. On the other hand, here you get your answer for sure, right away, and you get more than one.

You do not state your age or the size of the place where you live, and this makes a big difference on your possible course of action.

How do you know for sure she is planning to kill you? Has she threatened? In front of a witness who would tell the truth, and not lie to protect her? Then go to the police and file a formal complaint.

Are there other forms of true abuse present? (I'm not talking about stealing your phone calls - that's extremely rude, disrespectful, selfish and obnoxious, but it doesn't legally qualify as abuse.) You say she has a violent temper. Has it gone as far as physical violence? If yes, go to the police and file a complaint NOW. And the next time it happens, CALL 9-1-1. The police will get involved, there will be a report, and they'll see to it than any bruise or injury is documented medically.

If you're over 18 -
Find a job if you don't already have one, ANY job, and move out. Rent a room in a rooming house if you have to. Anything to get out of there.

If there is a reason why you cannot move out and there is physical violence involved:
a) File a complaint with the police about that and tell them why you feel she is planning to kill you.
b) Call a woman's shelter on how to get out of there right away. The police, or a social worker, perhaps someone at the doctor's office (services offered will vary depending on location and size of it) can direct you to some resources. There is a 3-digit number you can call to get references in need, but I don't know what it is in the US. 4-1-1 should be able to tell you - or another poster.

If you're under 18 -
Especially about the excessive drinking and the planning to kill you - call Child Protective Services. 4-1-1 will have the number to that if you don't know where to find it.

If you post again with more detail, we may offer more relevant suggestions. Keep us posted. We're all worried now.

Concern in today's paper by hanging Loose in CA about future for he and his wife. I am a veteran also and recently buried my love in a National Cemetery and should tell him that his wife can also receive the same service. It is without cost. I also had my wife at home and not in a funeral home - it was great to spend our last few nights together.

Re: Chris
" Meanwhile, he had morphed from a fit sports star into an overweight, middle-aged has-been"
That is called poetic justice!

Re: Amy Russell

Please accept belated condolences for your loss. If you are a believer, then you know that it is but a matter of time before you two are reunited. In the meantime, count your blessings - you are not all alone. Unless they go together in some car accident, one of the two in the LW2 equation will be at one point. My heart goes out to both of them.

@ MIKE H. RE: J.D. Message didn't go thru on personal message.

LW1: Why are you acting like you have no power or control here? You're not a victim. Your children are. I will never understand people like you who are so desperate for everyone to like them even the toxic ones. Get some self-esteem and start being a better mother to your children.

LW1 - Most people said what I was going to say but it's worth repeating, I think.

I think the Annies are tip toeing around this. Favoritism not only messes with a child's self-esteem, but it also hurts their reltionships with others invovled. Put and end to it NOW. The Annies said to bring it up to the ILs, as if they don't know what they're doing. Ha! They know exactly what they're doing and they don't care. So tell them that the favoritism ends or there will be consequences, such as little to no visits.

Like sarah morrow said, do not give excuses. Just say, "I'm sorry, that won't work for us." Do not justify, argue, defend or explain. That only opens the gates for an arguement.

As for you wimp of a husband, Lise said it right. Tell him that since he's not going to do anything, you will. And that you will be taking the bull by the horns.

LW2 - Are you sure your wife can't be buried with you in a VA Cemetery? My grandfather served in WW2 and my grandmother is buried next to him. And she died 15 years before him. Please look into that.

@ Joyce/MN Post 11

Oh sweetie, that had to be hard for you to write that post. I'm so sorry for the loss of your father and brother, even tho it has been a while. I can honestly say that I have been very fortunate not to have a loved one on MY side of the family pass away while being overseas. But my husband's mother, a nephew, 2 brothers in-law and 2 sisters have passed away in the, almost 21 yrs. here. The one sister was from Albert Lea, she was 60.

We just never know. Take care and try to do something productive today to keep your mind off it so you're not feeling down in the dumps the whole day. You're such a sweet person and I love reading your posts.

LW # 2 Please check with the VA. I believe your wife may be buried in a national cemetery as well. My cousin, whose husband is a USAF veteran was buried in a national cemetery in Texas 2 years ago.

Joyce/MN, I send hugs. Sorry for your losses and your tears today.

Joyce/MN, I send hugs. Sorry for your losses and your tears today.

@Chris -- I just way to say that your post, on all three topics today, was awesome.

LW2: WTF? Over 80 years old and you don't have a savings account or life insurance? Were you both transported from the 1800's by the Time Machine? Frankly, these people sound totally retarded. Just let them die and the County can bury them in Potter's Field.

Re: Katzling
They weren't transported from the 1800's by a time machine, they were transported to the poorhouse 2012 from the Rotten Economy machine. Lots of us there, and none of us are retarded. You, however, sound pretty much so, if you don't know the plight of many people right now. Or you're totally oblivious to the real world, living in your little pink bubble, sitting pretty on your pile of money, and all smug and content because you've got it ALL figured out.

Instead of counting your blessings and realising your good fortune (pun intended), you go an spit on the not so lucky. People like you make me sick. Yrrrch.

Re: Katzling

What a truly awful, uncaring person you must be! I hope you and all your money are very happy together, since I find it hard to believe you have too many friends.

Hi this is Lise - I hane all the time in the world to post!

nuff said loser!

Fuck you Lise! I am sure u understand. Same to you PS and Zoe you freak show!

@ "lise brouilette"

Wow! Invented a phony login just to attack another poster? Gee, pathetic much?!?!

Re: Lise and Kitty

Sorry, I don't think that the "Rotten Economy" has anything to do with being irresponsible, as this couple appears to be. I was too harsh when I described them as retarded, though. And FYI, I do NOT have a big pile of money to sit on, as you put it -- like many of us I live paycheck to paycheck. I just consider myself a Realist and this couple certainly doesn't have to have a bank account with thousands or even hundreds of dollars, and they can purchase Colonial LIfe insurance for a very minimal amount. Also, my husband and I happen to be Veterans and the VA Administration can defintely help them (if they do the footwork) - otherwise Potter's Field is where they will end up. I have a lot of friends, BTW, and I routinely get compliments on my helpfulness and caring attitude by both my fellow co-workers and the public which I assist every day at my job.

I don't know who this is but I would never post like this. But I still feel PS and Zoe are crazy. sorry. BTW - i called my ex again and he hung up on me....what do you all think THAT means

@chris, protect her now, you hated her so far. Beware! I think you drank the koolaid dude!

Yes Chris I am as sorry as you for making up w/Lise as you did.

Yes Chris you hit the nail on the head Pathetic!

Re: Katzling
Why in the world would LW2 want to waste money on life insurance? The purpose of life insurance is to protect a salary. At 80 they have no salary to protect and no children at home protect it for. Any money you suggest should be spent on life insurance would be far better used to put food on the table.
If you think they need it for paying final expenses, forget that. As many posters have said, as he is a veteran, they both can get their final burial needs met as no or very little cost to them.

Re: Posts 35, 36, 37, 40, 41, 42 & 43
I'm sure anyone sensible will have figured out quickly this is not me... Even with my potty mouth, I am more literate than THAT. This sounds like an angry 10 year-old, and one who's not very good in school.

@Chris
Thank you, this is appreciated.

@ Post #39, Ms Kat-ching
You may not be sitting on a pile of money, but not on a lot of compassion either. The rotten economy has plenty to do with whatever money you have available to be "responsible" with, like you say. Putting food on the table and paying the rent come way ahead of insurance and retirement funds. Even the "minimal amount' you're talking about, if you don't got it, you don't got it, get it? You seem to think that EVERYBODY has that kind of disposable money and you're dead wrong - even 20 bucks a month might as well be 20 million if you simply don't have it. And read JH's post #44 - you're not only dead wrong, you don't even know what you're talking about.

And you claim to "routinely get compliments on my helpfulness and caring attitude by both my fellow co-workers and the public which I assist every day at my job"? You sure ain't caring HERE, honeybunch. Must be your super-hero's secret identity.

John Dung, is that you pulling Lise's braids again? It's cute.

Re: Katzling #39

Congratulations -- you hide your helpful and caring attitude very well! Not everyone is able to "plan ahead" in this economy and save for the future when they're trying to live day to day. You have no idea what their struggles may have been and how much they may have cost these people. Calling them names is hardly "helpful" OR "caring". I stand by my original post and agree totally with Lise!

With 'annoyed in atlanta' you are worrying about the wrong kid!! You described my upbringing with the grands and I was the 2 yr. old. the destruction is on the elder child. I had a great happy-go-lucky childhood..my sister did not. since when is it normal to make a child sit "for the whole visit" with the elders?? let the kid be a kid! my sister has terrible memories of her childhood. I have great memories! JAM

Well, since I've been told to learn the fine art of shutting up, I take that to mean that I've hurt somebody's feelings. I'm sorry. I thought I've been invited to share my perspective on things. I thought that's what continuing education meant. Obviously I haven't dropped out, nor have I refused to compromise, because here I am giving money to the family, which is was I thought I was supposed to be doing. I don't really understand what it means to go to adventure camp, or share in the housecleaning. I'm not refusing anything, I just don't know what is actually being offered, what is playful fun and good natured teasing, what is a preview of the Book and what is suggestions to help; sometimes it all runs together. Sometimes I think targets are set up for me to knock down, sometimes I think I'm being asked for insight, sometimes I think I'm being given gifts out of kindness and thanks and sometimesd i feel like I'm being courted and wooed. I like you and don't understand why I'm being told to shut up. My feelings are hurt.

Re: Me
Where did anyone tell you to shut up? Don't see that anywhere. Personally, I have no idea what you're talking about and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

LW2
I haven't gone back to count the exact number, but I'd say at least five people BTL have confirmed that a couple can be buried together in a national cemetery, even if only one has served.

This means that the Annies did not do even the most basic of research to reassure the letter writer. {{ Sigh }}