Annie's Mailbox® by Kathy Mitchell and Marcy Sugar

LW1- I feel for LW1 & that her mom made her feel bad. It would have been much better if her mom had showed her how much less she would have had to pay if they had just gone to a doctor's office, and then talked about how many hours mom works to make $600 of take home pay or what it's equivalent to in goods/services that daughter would understand. It could have been a teachable moment. In my own case, our office co-pay is $25 and an ER visit early in the year could easily cost $600 out of pocket if we haven't hit our deductible. However, as much as I tried to teach my child that after she went to college & lived away from home, she didn't truly understand it until she got a job & was paying her co-pays & deductibles out of her own pocket. As for what the LW should do, probably just try to understand how the extra $600 seems to her mom. She could get a job herself, not to pay for her own medical care, but to appreciate how much work it is to make $600.

LW1- I feel for LW1 & that her mom made her feel bad. It would have been much better if her mom had showed her how much less she would have had to pay if they had just gone to a doctor's office, and then talked about how many hours mom works to make $600 of take home pay or what it's equivalent to in goods/services that daughter would understand. It could have been a teachable moment. In my own case, our office co-pay is $25 and an ER visit early in the year could easily cost $600 out of pocket if we haven't hit our deductible. However, as much as I tried to teach my child that after she went to college & lived away from home, she didn't truly understand it until she got a job & was paying her co-pays & deductibles out of her own pocket. As for what the LW should do, probably just try to understand how the extra $600 seems to her mom. She could get a job herself, not to pay for her own medical care, but to appreciate how much work it is to make $600.

LW1: How depressing it is to read that someone lived 30, 40, 50 years in some awful state and now must start over with nothing. A cautionary tale. But this retirement home does sound like an opportunity in desperate need of exploitation. The LW should apply her intelligence and determination to her situation and not just accept the way things are as she has for so many years. The time is now.

LW1
I think the Annies are dead wrong on this one. I'm sure your mother was actually upset over having to go to the emergency room and spend $600 when if you could have gone to the doctors office had you told her sooner. That in no way means that she is implying that your health is not worth the money. Hopefully this experience has shown you that now that you're getting older it's important to communicate with your family about any of your health concerns and your specific symptoms both to save yourself needless pain and suffering and save your folks money.

LW2
I agree with LouisaFinnell. Time to stop bellyaching and take action. You don't sound depressed to me - just out of practice.

LW3
For crying out loud people - if your loved one lives in a nursing home and is wearing really ratty clothes and you care enough to write to an advice column about it, then just throw them out and shell out a few bucks at Walmart and replace them. Don't spend too much because the staff and other residents may steal some of them and some may get lost. If the patient pitches a fit, so what? The person with dementia isn't going to care because they wont' even remember after a minute of two, just like many of the family members I've visited can't remember who I am or if they do know me, can't remember I was there 60 seconds after I'm gone. If they don't have dementia and they want to wear ratty clothes full of holes then let them.

* * * * PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT * * * *

LW3 refers to the second letter on 30 December 2012, and was also discussed on 7 February 2013.

Ok, who's the parent here? You are a kid. Unless this is a recurring illness how are you to know that it's a serious infection versus the flu. It is a parent's job to pay attention. If your kid is sick for more than a couple of days you bring them to the doctor. If the bill for the ER is too much mom has no one to blame but herself.
Honestly, I was in my 20's before I was sick with more than a simple cold, flu or ear infection. I had no clue why I wasn't feeling better. My plan had urgent care which took the $10 co pay. Until you are sick you don't know what the signs are. Next time she'll know.

Exactly, MT, and in addition it couldn't possibly be the case that the girl hesitated to complain about her ailment because she was accustomed to receiving short shrift and scant sympathy, could it? I can detect no reason for the Annies to jump to the conclusion that the mother was not angry about having to spend money on her daughter's health, when the mother STATED that she was angry about having to spend money on her daughter's health. The LW writes, “That was true, and I apologized.” Sounds to me like someone trying to be scrupulously fair and honest. So why do we read nothing along the lines of, “And she expressed sympathy for the pain I went through”? Because she didn't. This LW, I believe, would have said so. Would *love* to have been able to say so.

Then again, I have more jaundiced opinions about the potential range of motherly nurturance than most people.

LW1 - It sounds as though the mother wasn't paying enough attention to her daughter. It shouldn't be up to the child to decide when her illness is serious enough to go to the doctor, and after a day or so of her saying she wasn't feeling well the mother should have taken her to the doctor, not blaming her child for not knowing her illness was serious. Nowhere in the letter does the LW say that her mother expressed sympathy or relief that they caught the infection in time, and she says her relationship with her mother has never been good. I don't really have any advice for her -- if the mother had written, I'd have plenty! I can only say that I'm very glad they caught the problem in time and that the LW is now well. The mother is definitely lacking in parenting skills, and I hope her daughter doesn't have any lasting effects from her illness. I do NOT believe the anger was misplaced fear as the Annies said.

LW2 - I agree with LousaFinnell and EstherGreenwood that the LW doesn't sound depressed. She sounds frustrated and inexperienced at finding ways to make friends and organize activities. She doesn't WANT to be withdrawn from people, she wants to interact with them. That's not depression. Hopefully, she will find a way to get people involved in some activities, but it will be difficult for her to take the initiative after so many years of being repressed. I wish her good luck.

Yeah, I'm not sure what she should have told her parents that would have made the outcome any different. She says she told them she didn't feel well, and that was all she could tell them until her symptoms got worse. I assume in the hospital they ran some tests and determined she had a kidney infection, but I wouldn't be so sure that they wouldn't have had to go to the hospital even if she HAD seen her family doctor first.

LW1 - I think the Annies are defending the mother's reaction too much here. This child told her mother (I'm assuming it's a girl) that she didn't feel well and it sounds like the mother ignored her. When I was a kid, if I told my mother I didn't feel well, she would ask me, "What's wrong? What hurts? What aches?" etc. It doesn't sound as if the mother even listened to her because a few days later, she's yelling at her daughter for not saying something earlier. She DID! LW, I'm sorry that your mother yelled at you. She had no right to. The next time you don't feel well and speak up, make sure she hears you and ask right then and there to go and see a doctor.

LW2 - I don't think she's depressed, either, because she WANTS to make friends and isn't looking to withdraw from others. That's what depressed people do. But I'm wondering if the LW meets people and then whines about her life. If that's the case, that could be why nobody wants to have a friendship with her. LW, if you believe you're being negative all the time when you meet people, change that. Stay positive and talk about positive things. If that doesn't work, talk to your son about moving to another facility. I wish you luck.

LW1 -
There isn't much that can be suggested to you, because your mother is the one who was wrong here, and she's not the one writing.

A teenager is not equipped with enough reference points to know what wrong with her when she doesn't feel well, that's what a parent is supposed to be for. If it had been my daughter, I certainly would have grilled her with pointed questionuntil I found out how *exactly* she didn't feel well in order to at least have a list of symptoms to go to the doctor with. Your mother preferred to ignore you and then she complained about the consequences of what SHE did.

Next time this happens, try to make a list of the symptoms, and go on the Net to have a vague idea. Use the school computer or go to an Internet cafe if you don't have one at home. Complain to your mother right away (same as you did the last time) and, if she tries to ignore you again, remind her in no uncertain terms of what happened the last time she did that. I see no reason why you shouldn't rub her nose in it, if only to prevent her from doing it again.

P.S.: Did the doctor explain how you contracted that kidney infection so you can avoid it in future if possible? Are there any sequels? If there is a nurse at your school, talk to her or him. Go on the Net if there isn't, and don't check just one site - there is a lot of misinformation out there, and you have to sift. Try to stick to reputable sites attached to a major hospital, like the Mayo clinic site.

P.S.: Get a part-time job, open up a savings account and start saving your money. Move out the minute you can. You sure don't sound like you're valued where you are. Sigh.

LW2 -
Some of the Annies suggestions were good ones, but they also said, "People are attracted to those who are upbeat and energetic, and those traits are difficult for you to display when you feel so low", which is a not-so-subtle way of blaming the victim. And incorrecty - I have seen depressed people attract friendship.

You say you have been programmed to push people away. Can you identify some of the things you do that pushes people away? If yes, start working on those things, and stop yourself every time you catch yourself doing them. If not, is there a counsellor where you are you could talk to? You may need some help deprogramming and reprogramming yourself. Try to see at the public library is there aren't any self-help books you can borrow. If not, visit the local book store, used or new.

In the meantime, talk to someone in charge where you are to see if you cannot organise some activities - board games, playing cards. bingo, bowling, knitting, scrapbooking, reading club, movie club, etc. Are there classes you can take somewhere, at the university, a community or women's centre? Most universities have "continuing education" classes, that you can register for without having to be in a full undergraduate program. Can you volunteer anywhere, at the church for the bazaar, at the local food bank, cuddling babies at the children's hospital, visiting sick people at the hospital, the hospice, the veterans' centre?

If none of that works out, talk to your son, tell him he was lied to, that you're dreadfully unhappy and demand that he help you find another place, with REAL activities this time. Did you sign the house over to him or is it still yours? Threaten to take it back, or to move back in and invade him.

P.S.: Warning to other women with controlling husbands: This is what happens when you let someone isolate you. DON'T.

Re: Khlovia
Exactly. There certainly ARE parents for whom the kid is not worth 600 bucks, and I know because I wasn't worth that much to mine. My father used to throw up in my face the money he spent on me on clothing per year, as if I was supposed to go naked. Even my stepmother would take him to task over that. This coming from a man who had a waterfront house, a motorboat tied to the pier, a Mercedes in the garage and designer clothing on his wife's back.

Lise (#13) - That is such a shame! I'm sorry you had a father like that. My late Uncle Joe was very, very cheap. How cheap was he? He only flushed the toilet twice a week so he wouldn't waste water. Needless to say...his house stank. Anyway, he had vowed from the time he was in his 20's that he would never have children because "they cost too much money!" Had he had a child, he probably would've done what your father did. BTW, he had never been on a date in his life. Taking a woman out would involve spending money!

LW1: Actually, I'm going to back what the Annies said on this one. Going "no, it sounds like your mother doesn't love you," isn't really productive or helpful here, especially since they already have a poor relationship. Lord knows there could have been a million reasons why she acted as she did, and it's true that had they been able to just see a doctor, it would have been way cheaper. Most people don't just wake up in the morning and decide to be poor, uncaring parents. My friends and I often thought that about our parents as teenagers, and as we got older, we learned more about the context behind their decisions and why they behaved they way they did. It doesn't excuse poor treatment, but we at least knew they didn't set out to be "bad" parents, and even understood why some of the decisions they made were better than we thought.

LW2: As a socially awkward person myself, I advise breaking down your goals. Even if you're not "visiting" with people, try to get out of the house and talking to people at least. Keep on with volunteer work, churches, and other activities. If you're "approaching" 70, this has probably been going on 3-4 years at the most, and if you've been switching activities, you may not have stayed with anything long enough. People are far more reserved than they used to be, or so I'm told. But just being out of the house and interacting will help you feel better in the short term, and eventually that might lead to better relationships with people.

LW1--"Why would she insinuate such a thing? What should I do?" Your mother is the reason why I think there should be a written exam to qualify people as competent parents. Based on your statements about your relationship with your mother I will go out on a limb and guess that your mother is a drama queen who thinks the world revolves around her. I had a mother like this; everything had to be about her needs, her wants and she always put herself first. My advice is to stick it out for the next couple of years until you turn 18 then enjoy your adulthood. If your mother is like mine then any relationship with her will be entirely one-sided on your part and require you to do all the work. Good luck.

LW2--First, you don't sound terribly depressed; you sound like you've come to grips with reality. Yours is an age-old and perennial problem. As people grow older, they become comfortable with their social circles and it doesn't occur to them to cultivate new friendships are expand their circle of friends. Unfortunately, there's no easy remedy. My advice is to keep putting yourself out there; keep getting involved with new and varied groups and keep issuing invitations. If you cast your line enough times, odds are you'll get a bite.

LW1: What hit me about your letter was how sad it is that you didn't trust your mother to tell your symptoms earlier.

For many years, I had urinary tract infections and at one time, it progressed to a kidney infection. It took awhile to get there and it was PAINFUL. That's probably why your mom was upset: usually to get to the kidney stage, it takes at least a week if not more and in the interim you KNOW something is wrong. She's probably upset that you didn't tell her when you were in pain before and yes, she could have avoided paying an emergency room fee (not cheap) as well as the potential danger to your health (kidney infections can result in kidney FAILURE!).

So count this as a lesson learned: listen to your body and for now (until you have your own medical insurance), lean on your parents to make the call whether or not it is a trip to the doctor or over the counter remedies or what. And please don't come down too hard on your mom. I love my daughter DEARLY but if she did what you had done I would have been angry too, for just the reasons I detailed above.

LW2: While some of the wise BTLers (Kitty, Louisa and Esther) do NOT think you are depressed, I think you very well could be.

Your last line "I'll be 70 soon, and I feel life isn't worth living if I have to be alone." is a classic symptom of depression. And let me ask you something, LW. Are depressed people FUN to be around? Of course not. It becomes a vicious cycle: you can't have friends because you are depressed and you are depressed because you don't have friends.

I would suggest that you take a more aggressive approach here. First of all, yes, I would look into therapy. While you moved back to your hometown, you still don't know anyone there and that in and of itself is depressing. So get with a therapist or a group. Part of the process of therapy is that you have a SAFE place to express your feelings. You need that right now. You aren't going to make any friends by telling them (at least now) how depressed and lonely you are. That just makes you look desparate. Get a therapist so you have a place to vent these feelings and also to look into the damage your husband did to you by insisting your friend group only come from his approved list (classic form of spousal abuse, btw).

Secondly, give church another try. Just filling out a visitor's card is NOT enough. My church has a policy that although we contact the visitors (and new people get a "starter's kit" filled with DVDs, a Bible and contact names) we do so via snail mail and let the visitors come to US. There's a good reason for that. Many churches (this can also depend on the denomination, btw) get "church shoppers": people who will show up once or twice and then move to another church. Also, many people fill in those cards as JOKES so it's hard to know who to contact and who not to. I would go BACK to church and ask to speak with someone directly. The ushers at the end of service can help you out: just go up to them and ask to speak to someone who can help you with membership stuff. My church, BTW, would love to have someone like you involved because you have free time during the day. We have a need for people to help with the overseas ministry as well as the work we do here locally with the homeless and people in need.

Before you go to your church again, you should also look up online to see if they have a website with contact information. I wrote about this at Abby the other day, but our church (and most churches these days) have a large web/Facebook/Twitter presence and often the opportunities are posted there as opposed to declared in church like the old days. When I signed up on our website, I was given a church mentor (a member of the church) who helped navigate me to different groups I could get involved in. She emails me twice a week: just checking in type things, but we've become friends.

And some other ideas: get a part time job if you are able to physically and financially, volunteer (my mother met a LOT of people when she volunteered at the Red Cross), start a card club at your retirement place or quilting or whatever is your thing. My mother (who moved to her area when she was about your age) met a TON of people by joining a gym: she's always been active and even now at 85 can outwalk most of her kids. Another friend's mother met people by forming her own Kinect dance tournament at her retirement home (!).... you have to get creative.

But bottom line: happy people attract happy people and unhappy people don't attract anyone. Get busy first by working on yourself, and yes, I think therapy is in order. Best of luck!

Well I for one can see a mopey teen filled with typical teenage superiority and angst saying "I don't feel good" "Why, what's wrong?" "I don't know... leave me alone, I just don't feel good". repeat ad nauseum because that's how it is communicating with some teens. Sure mom could have investigated more on her own or the LW could have been more open. I kidney infection doesn't happen overnight, they usually begin with a UTI and bladder infection which everyone knows is not easy to ignore because you are literally peeing blood at times. Maybe she was embarrassed of this. Frankly I think LW needs to admit her neglect in this case and stop blaming other people.

Well, I have had several kidney infections over the years, and my first one, I had no UTI first--I had back pain, and an eventual fever. This went on for a couple weeks and got worse and worse until my pediatrician figured it out. In any case, it isn't this kid's fault, the parent's job is to parent. Now she knows to speak up sooner. Poor kiddo.

Re: Jers

Agree with you totally on both 1 and 2 :)

Reply to Mom upset over hospital bill.I to was a teenager and got my front teeth knocked out while throwing a baseball when the sun got in my eyes.My Dad yelled at me all the way to the hospital,like I did this on purpose I was 16 and had to go to school without front teeth for 2 weeks. I was also walking through a field with flip flops on and cut my little toe and had to have stitches again I got yelled I don't think he was concerned about money he just didn't know how to show feelings. His Mom said I don't know why he yells because he was an only child and she showed love all the time.

LW1: This letter is sad. Regardless of the mom's intention, it's not right to throw it in someone's face that their illness cost a lot of money. I understand that kidney infections are super painful and you just overall feel sick when you have one. The daughter (son?) didn't need a guilt trip on top of feeling icky.
Also, I 100% disagree with the Annies. If the mom was truly worried about the child's health, and her waiting too long to say something, she would have picked a better time to say something than when the bill arrived. Her words would have been closer to “You need to speak up the next time you don't feel well so we can you help right away” rather than “Look at how much you cost me!”

@LW2: BTL gave good advice of just keep casting your line and someone is sure to bite. However, there is something about your letter that's… just whiney. I get the feeling that you meet someone once and don't understand why you're not best friends. Just be patient. Friendships (especially good ones) take time. Also, make sure you're pleasant to be around and aren't a Debbie Downer. You don't have to be fake, but ask yourself “Would I enjoy spending time with me?”

Great advice on LW2, Jers

Re: Bean123

I would agree with you if the LW was 10 or under. But this is a teenager who, I believe although it's not clear from the letter itself, took HERSELF to the emergency room. This isn't a small child, this is a YOUNG ADULT. She should know she has to go through her parents insurance to get medical help and the way I read it, she went outside of the avenues her parents could have gone through if they knew earlier. And as a young adult, she should have vocalized her symptoms so that her parents could have made the decisions for her.

Re: nanchan
Well, my point was that not everyone has the same experience with a kidney infection. I was 17 or 18 when I had my first one and I simply had no idea. I was having back pain, and I thought I was coming down with a bug. Most people don't run to the doctor right away when they get a bug or have some back pain. I was using heating pads for the back pain but it wasn't until I got much much worse that even my dad, who is a doctor, put two and two together and took me to the pediatrician. I don't expect a teenager to recognize the difference between, oh, I'm feeling under the weather, and oh, this is a serious medical issue, when the adults in my life, including a physician didn't. I just happened to become acute during the day when I could reach a doctor. It's on the parent to be a parent and realize that a) something unusual is going on or b) sometimes acute sickness doesn't happen at a convenient time.

LW3, if your mother with dementia wears the same clothes over and over, there's a simple solution when they get ratty: replace them with new, similar items.

My grandmother loved her navy blue cardigan. So much so that when it got worn out we simply bought a new navy blue cardigan and threw out the old one. She never noticed a difference. Problem solved!

LW2, lots of good advice, and the trick, I think, is that the LW has to keep trying new and different things until she finds what works *for her*. For some people, church is a great way to meet people; for others, not so much. But church IS a good suggestion, in general, for the problem of meeting new people -- it just didn't work for the LW, so time to move on to the next suggestion. I also think attitude adjustment is important, because it's quite true that it's hard for strangers to warm up to you if you seem standoffish or aloof.

LW1, It's so hard to say if the Annies' generation interpretation of the LW's mother is right or not. It's certainly entirely possible, and in fact it could be that the mother's anxiety over the situation, and her guilt at not noticing her daughter's discomfort sooner, is what caused her to erupt *at* her daughter. A lot of people misdirect their feelings of (internal) guilt into something external like anger at someone else. It may be a case of deflection.

OTOH, since they don't have the greatest relationship anyway, it's entirely possible the LW's mother IS more upset about the expense than anything else. But still, that doesn't help the LW. As long as LW is still a minor living at home, it's probably best to try to forgive her mother and strive for a harmonious home life -- until she's an adult and can move out and take care of herself.

Oooh Mike H! I love the reverse progression approach, nicely done.

Re: Bean123

So your dad is a bad parent because he can't READ YOUR MIND?

That's the issue here.

I don't agree with how the mother allegedly communicated this (and let's face it, the LWs are always angels and everyone else is ALWAYS to blame), but as a parent myself, I'd be angry, hurt and confused if my daughter didn't alert me to something early on that developed into a potential problem.

Thank goodness the LW wasn't pregnant and thought the baby would "just go away"..... because we see that a lot as well.

Re: Michelle
Not to mention supporting a woman... He would have been the kind to DEMAND that she go out and work and support herself (because God forBID he should have to extend money for the privilege of having her around), while still having the whole household on her back and expecting her to be at his beck and call!

Well, he must have been very surprised, when he crossed to the other side, to find out that money doesn't mean shit over there and that he couldn't take it with him!

The problem with my father was not cheapness, but that my mother died when I was 12 and he felt guilty, because the woman he remarried with immediately was the mistress who was already pregnant by him at the time my mother took her own life. I would have had to be old enough to fend for myself and get out of his way. I wasn't.

And I had the misfortune of having my mother's face, so he felt haunted by the ghost of marriages past every time he looked at me. People who feel guilty can do very bad things... I was shoved in a corner like an unwanted piece of furniture you can't give away, and made to feel like I should have been wet with gratitude because he didn't drop me on the church steps with a bag of clothing and a name tag. It should have been my luck to have her face, as she was very beautiful. I had beauty all my life, I have enough of it left even now... But unfortunately, beauty never did anything for me.

Poor kid. I'd take her in if I could.

Re: nanchan
No, I'm not accusing my dad of being a bad parent at all. I told him about my back pain, but it didn't seem like a big deal to me until it got worse. He figured out what was going on, by talking to me, and took me to the pediatrician. We were communicating. I /have/ a good relationship with my dad.

This girl has a bad relationship with her mom. If she's not communicating with her mom, it's on the mom. She mentioned she didn't feel well, she didn't realize the signs or symptoms of a kidney infection (she's a teen!). If my son tells me he's not feeling well, I am concerned enough to question him further and find out what's going on, and take him to the doctor. If he got so sick suddenly that I had to take him to the ER, I'd be kicking myself for not taking action earlier, /not/ blaming him. He is the child, I am the parent. I might /say/ hey, next time you're feeling so bad, tell me right away so I can make sure you don't reach this point, but if my teenager isn't talking to me about her extreme misery, I'd be looking at /myself/.

This mom was blowing off her duty as a parent (how could she have not noticed how bad her daughter was feeling?) and then putting the blame on the child. That's ridiculous. It's a parent's job as the PARENT to actually parent. If your teen isn't talking to you, look at yourself and figure out why. Buy some parenting teen books.

Re: nanchan
Nanchan, the girl is NOT a young adult. For someone who claims to love children so much, I find you awfully harsh on this young lady, not "adult". You're a young adult after you're 18, and even then, a lot of kids that age are still not mature enough to be independent. Not to mention that the frontal cortex, where the impulse control and consequence evaluation centre is, doesn't reach full maturity before early twenties at best. They're still teenagers. And this one is not even there yet. She doesn't say her exact age. For all we know she could be 13.

"So your dad is a bad parent because he can't READ YOUR MIND?"
And the LW certainly can't be blamed because she couldn't read in her crystal ball that a general feeling of unfitness was actually the onset of a serious problem.

You're not that much in touch with your own body at that age, that's the kind of stuff you figure out little by little over the years. It's entirely possible that the first symptoms were so vague and diffuse that she didn't know how to describe them, and that she didn't dare complain too much before she knew more. And what Khlovia said.

In all seriousness and without malicious intent, Lise, you have some issues and seem so very angry at the world, specifically men. You could probably benefit from seeing a psychologist.

Re: Mike H

Great advice for LW3

Re: Bean123

I'm sorry, I disagree with you.

I was taught, and I taught MY daughter, that I am the best judge of what is happening in my own body. Telling doctors (and your parents) about the pains you have starts when you are LITTLE. It's how you get help.

For your FATHER, a DOCTOR, to blow off your own complaints says to me he's not a great doctor nor a great parent.

Or you didn't talk. And at 17-18, you should have known better. Shame on you for blaming the mother.

I'll bet if the LW was a year and half older you all would be calling her a "HELICOPTER PARENT" (your go-to label for parents who hover too much)

I just disagree with you. Have a wonderful day.

@Miss Pasko, thanks, I was just in the mood to mix it up a bit. :-)

Conversation with my (then) 3 year old daughter:

Me: Where does it hurt?
Her: Here.
Me: Can you point to it?
Her: (points)
Me: (feels forehead, takes temperature) Can you eat some soup?

Then I call the doctor. All it takes is a POINT even at 3!

Conversation with my (then) 10 year old daughter:

Me: Where does it hurt?
Her: It hurts in my tummy.
Me: Can you point to it?
Her: (points)
Me: Can you eat?
Her: No, I feel icky. I want to sleep.
Me: Ok: go sleep. (

Then I call the doctor.

Conversation with my (now) 20 year old daughter (much closer to 18)

Me: How do you feel?
Her: I feel feverish, and I have a stomachache.
Me: How do you think we should proceed? Do you want me to call the doctor? Let's see how hot you are.
Her: I think I'm ok.
Me: DId you sleep last night?
Her: No, I can't lay on my right side.
Me: I think it's time to call the doctor. You talk to him ok?

The point is that different ages require different actions. I don't talk to my daughter the same way at her age as I did when she was little. As a teenager who can obviously express herself (because she WROTE the letter for goodness sakes!), the LW needs to own up to her own lack of communication in this matter.

I agree that nowhere does it say this LW1 teen is a girl, so I assume that part was edited out of the letter. But that's besides the point. The Annies advice is wrong that the mother is saying one thing but means another. The example regarding a mother yelling at her 2-year-old for running into the street doesn't even suport their statement. In a case like that, the mom would scream, "don't run into the street", not "why didn't you finish your dinner" or "how dare you get your clothes dirty". The LW's mother was angry about the bill, and that's exactly what she said and exactly what she meant. She doesn't like to see money "wasted", and she sees the child's delay as a "mistake" that wasted money. That's not really the same as saying she doesn't think her child's health is worth the money. But she's a bit of blank to be so harsh on her child for something like this. She also should have paid more attention shen the child said he/she didn't feel well.

I was 28 when I got a kidney infection. I'd had surgery on the fifteenth, was discharged from the hospital on the twentieth, was on massive pain killers, which is why I didn't feel the urinary tract infection. The UTI turned into a bladder infection and when I waited too long to go to the bathroom, it pushed up into my kidney. I had no idea what was wrong and felt like I was going to die. I ended up back in my doctors office on Christmas Eve and spent Christmas Day crying because I felt so bad. Getting out of bed and walking to the bathroom was exhausting, and any food is exhausting to eat. Nothing tastes good and made me feel nauseated.

I had a nasty case of salmonella food poisoning when my daughter was eleven months old and I ended up in the hospital twice for intravenous fluids. It wasn't quite as bad as the kidney infection, but still, it was hell. My husband was angry with me because he thought I was being a whiner over a little diarrhea and vomiting. Boy did he feel bad when the tests came back positive for salmonella.

On the flip side...

My niece likes to get attention for her problems. Seriously, she will feel like she is at death's door and she won't say anything to her Mom about it until it is so bad it requires a trip to the emergency room. And there, she tells the doctor that she didn't say anything to her Mom because she didn't want to upset her mother. My sister-in-law has NEVER gotten angry at either of her kids for needing help. NEVER. This is a nasty form of passive-aggressive behavior that my niece learned from her father and she has learned to use it to punish her mother.

My nieces latest ploy was to read with a book an inch from her face and told everyone she couldn't see. Then she said her mother didn't have the time or money to get her glasses. She spun a real sob story. My niece went home and must have been reading normally because my sister-n-law did not do anything about it. I asked my sister-in-law if my niece was happy about wearing glasses and my sister-in-law was flabbergasted, she didn't know anything about it, because she had never seen her daughter read something so close to her face. I told my SIL what I knew and saw and she then told me that the girl does things like this to use against her later. I apologized to my SIL and told her what I knew about passive-aggressive behavior and what steps I have taken to avoid being treated that way.

Parents can't read minds. And kids do feel like they are a burden to their parents at times. Also, some kids can only get their parents attention when something is dreadfully wrong. It's a lot like "A Christmas Story" when Ralphie has the fantasy about "soap poisoning" and is thrilled with becoming blind because of Life boy soap. That'll fix them! he gloats.

This young person who wrote in, only she/he can answer if she/he waited to get help until it was a crisis or if she/he didn't know what was happening. I'm of a mind to give her/him the benefit of the doubt given my experience with a kidney infection.

I do know that with girls, my mother got good and sick of hearing about my cramps every month. My mother suffered through cramps (her mother wouldn't even let her take aspirin) and her mother made her use old rags, while her mother got to go to the drugstore and get new fangled sanitary napkins. By the time my Mother had girls that were menstruating, she had no sympathy for us when we got to take tylenol and had a choice of sanitary napkins or tampons.

I have a tremendously good mother. She was raised by a selfish and self-centered mother without a lick of common sense and has gone on to be a fantastic person. My mother was dragged to the doctor as soon as she sniffled because her mother wanted attention from the doctors. But if her mother had a social function to go to, my mother could have been bleeding to death and the woman would not have even considered altering her plans. But despite this upbringing, my mother has gone on to raise four kids who speak to one another and actually like each other. None of us have been on Jerry Springer or have been arrested. But even my Mom has moments she wishes she could take back.

I also have sympathy for the mother in this situation because undoubtedly, she feels bad that she didn't have a sixth sense about her child. If the family is in dire straits financially, this would add to the stress already present.

This is an opportunity for the letter writer to change the relationship with her/his mother. It's up to them to work out how they communicate and support each other. I wish them all the luck in the world.

When I was a child, I had an ear infection. My mother later told me, quite upset, that she had no idea until it got really bad because I didn't say anything. I don't know why I didn't say anything, I suspected it hurt and I could be a problematic, dramatic piece of s when I was little. My mother is a doctor, a pediatrician, in fact, and knows diseases a mile away. There was no giant bill, though my mother has put on a fit about money on many occasions. And I have no idea why she told me this years after it happened. I couldn't even remember being sick. I don't know to this day why she was upset, but I do know for a fact that my mother loves me.

I agree that it does no good to tell a kid who has no other choice but to live at home, go to school, and brush her teeth, that her mother doesn't love her. It's really just best to assume it was over something else and move on.

Re: It's Me

Not all URIs are the same, and not everyone experiences the same symptoms. A friend of mine, for example, has no pain when she has URIs. She only realizes she has one IF she pees blood (which doesn't always happen), or her kidneys get infected, or they detect it during a test for something else.

I have had a lot of URIs in my life and most of them hurt like hell, but some of them only hurt a little bit which can be confused with the feeling you get when you pee if you hold it in a bit too long. Yes, it takes a while for the kidneys to be affected, but the symptoms you have BEFORE your kidneys are infected don't necessarily get really bad.

And not everyone bleeds when they pee. I never have bloody urine with a URI. I know it's there because of the intense burning which I don't even have in about 20-30% of them. I know it's a URI because I've had a million of them, but if the first one I had was like that, I wouldn't know what was going on.

And sometimes sore kidneys can feel like a back ache -- the first time I had a kidney infection, I thought I had slept funny and my back hurt -- or like sore muscles from exercising.

Re: nanchan

I don't see anything that indicates that she went to the ER by herself.

You also say: "I'd be angry, hurt and confused if my daughter didn't alert me to something early on that developed into a potential problem."

The LW clearly stated that she told her parents she didn't feel well. We don't know exactly what she said, but a kidney infection could EASILY manifest itself as something that could be described as "I don't feel well". At that point, it was her mother's job to delve deeper, monitor, and take her to the doctor if she doesn't say she feels better.

In your post #37, if your daughter (at any age) came and said: "I don't feel good" and you replied "oh, that's a shame" and didn't ask any other questions, that would be your fault, not your kid's fault.

Re: Bean123

LOL, hey, an internet stranger says with conviction your dad is a shitty parent and doctor. I am sure she knows best! Doesn't he know you're supposed to rush kids to the hospital when they have mild back soreness?? GEEZ.

Re: Jane

With a kidney infection, almost certainly a girl, and also the "not as a pretty as a penny" name wouldn't go great with a guy. It's possible but unlikely.

Re: Volpe

I don't think her mother doesn't love her. I do think she was upset at having to spend that money. I would be irritated in the context. IMO, being upset at spending money doesn't mean you don't feel that it wasn't worth spending it. It's also easy to condemn the mother for her attitude when we are not the ones who just got a $600 bill. She did not handle it correctly in the way she communicated it to her daughter, but I do think her daughter is making way too much out of the comment.

Re: nanchan
I'd appreciate if you'd stop with the aspersions on my dad's parenting or abilities as a physician. He is, in fact, a great father and a great physician, and has /never/ been sued, which is amazing as an oncologist in this day and age in this country. In that particular case, he wasn't dismissing my symptoms, he was keeping an eye on me, and treating the symptoms, which is what you generally do when you get sick with non specific symptoms. /I/ don't go to the doctor at the first sign of illness-do you? I wait a couple days (unless my symptoms are bad), to see if I get better on my own.

I also had a history of back injury and back pain, and I wasn't familiar with how a kidney infection feels like. So he went with the treat for back pain approach--I /wasn't/ feverish at that point or having UTI symptoms. My mystery symptoms finally proceeded to a point where it was clear that I wasn't healing on my own, and we went to the pediatrician for blood work and a urine sample, voila, everything was made clear. During this whole time, the lines of communication /were/ kept open, so as soon as I really /was/ feeling quite unwell, sparking a fever, etc I saw the doctor that same morning. But my point was that my symptoms /suddenly/ became acute. If that had happened in the middle of the night, my father would have taken me to the ER (or called one of his friends to come to the house and check me out).

The LW has learnt a lesson about speaking up. I don't expect that a teen would already know the difference between regular sick and serious sick--they aren't doctor's, and a kidney infection isn't necessary any worse than any other bug at first. You claim that she should already have known her body and to speak up when she's not feeling well. Well, that's /also/ on the parents. Parents raising a child properly should have taught her to know her body and speak up about being sick /already/. The fact that they didn't shows that they simply aren't good parents. And finally, if she's in an environment where she doesn't feel comfortable speaking up about her issues, that's on the parents. It's the /parent's/ job to clarify and keep those lines of communication open, not the child. Your example shows /you/ translating for the teen and figuring out the degree of the problem, proving /my/ point.

Re: Bean123

"/I/ don't go to the doctor at the first sign of illness-do you? I wait a couple days (unless my symptoms are bad), to see if I get better on my own."

That's the way to do it. I hate seeing the doc's office or the ER full of people who don't really need to be there, getting antibiotics for things that aren't bacterial, or getting x-rays for mild sprains. BAH.

LW1 -- just one observation that I don't think I've seen made by someone else already (though I didn't read the BTL all that closely, so mea culpa if it's already been brought up): where is the father in all this? The LW does refer to "my parents," so presumably the father is alive and still in the picture. But after that, there is no mention of him. It's all about her mother's reaction and her already-troubled relationship with her mother. Was the father not around when the mother went on her tirade about the medical bill? What is her relationship with her father like? What was his reaction (if there was any) to all of this? I know that this doesn't offer anything in the way of advice for the LW, but these are important questions, IMHO.

Bean: tell you what. I'll stop judging your father (who is a DOCTOR) for not knowing the symptoms of the LW's issue when YOU stop judging the LW's mother (who is NOT a doctor) as well.

Deal?

LW 1 Not all moms are loving and care about their kids. If I complained about any illness my mom said it would get better by itself. If my kids are sick I ask them exactly what symptoms they have, what hurts and how does it feel. I take them to the doctor if I have any doubt at all. Some moms are just bad moms.

LW3 -- Unlike the venerable Miss Pasko, I don't usually bother to check the original letter in a case like this, where the LW is responding to a previous letter -- I, apparently, am far more lazy than Miss Pasko! So, with that said, I don't remember the original letter, nor did I go back to check it, but if I'm reading THIS letter correctly and if THIS LW correctly understood the original letter, the original LW was on staff at a long-term care facility and was bemoaning the fact that some of her patients wear the same stuff over and over again, suggesting that the relatives apparently didn't care enough to spend the money to buy new clothes for their aging, ill relatives at the care facility. LW3 wasn't asking for advice, she was merely pointing out that the fact that someone (especially someone suffering from dementia) in a nursing home-type facility wearing the same thing over and over again may have NOTHING to do with the family not caring enough to buy new clothes for the patient. My grandmother died a few months ago after living in an alzheimer's care facility for more than 10 years. A few realities about the way these things go:

1) My mother routinely bought my grandmother new clothing. That clothing frequently disappeared. Sometimes it disappeared because my grandmother gave it away, or managed to misplace it. Sometimes it disappeared because one of the other alzheimer's patients would think it was hers and take it. And, yes, it's also possible that someone on staff or the family member of another patient stole it (and I say that with all due respect to the members of staff at these facilities, who are frequently underpaid and have an extraordinarily difficult job and most of whom are honest and would never steal from their patients).

2) The problem with the suggestions of "just get rid of the old stuff, even if she complains about it -- she'll forget about it five minutes later" -- is that A) alzheimer's and other forms of dementia work in mysterious ways, and you'd be amazed at the things that somehow "stick" with them and B) when you know you are dealing with someone who basically can only live in the "right now" it can be extremely difficult and painful to knowingly make that "now" unpleasant. We tried to take my grandmother's wedding ring from her for safekeeping -- we knew she was either going to misplace it or it would be stolen. But she was beyond heartbroken when we tried to take it, and eventually, my mother said, "you know, we only want to put it in 'safekeeping' so that we can inherit it, not so that she can one day enjoy it again. I'm letting her keep it so she can enjoy it right now for as long as she can." We'll never know what happened to that ring, and maybe my mother should have taken it away, but by not taking that ring away, my mother gave her mother a few extra moments of joy -- something that is all-too-precious for someone trapped in dementia.

LW3 wasn't seeking advice, she was simply trying to explain to the original LW that a person in a nursing home wearing the same clothes over and over again doesn't NECESSARILY indicate the family doesn't care about that person anymore and is neglecting that person. I would think that someone who actually works in one of these facilities would be aware of this.

Re: nanchan
I'm not judging the LW's mother for not knowing her daughter had a kidney infection. I'm judging the mother for blaming her daughter for not speaking up because the daughter /did/ speak up, albeit not very clearly, but that is how most kids communicate. It is the parent's /job/ to delve deeper, not the child's. (You're not feeling well? How bad? Where does it hurt?) If you want your child to be a better communicator, you have to /teach/ them, and create an environment where communication feels safe to the child. Clearly the mother failed completely at doing either of those things. And then she had the audacity to blame the LW for her ER visit? Epic fail as a parent.
If you are the kind of parent that thinks that you should blame your child for allowing herself to get sick enough to go to the ER, you are /bad/ parent, period.
There are only two reasons the mom had to take her child to the ER. 1) The child became acutely sick in a short period of time, where there was no opportunity to take them to the doctor. or 2) The mom /failed/ to notice the acuity of her child's illness because she wasn't paying attention. In either case, the child was /not/ at fault.

Also,
if my child didn't feel comfortable enough to tell me how bad she was feeling, which then resulted in a $600 ER visit, I would not be upset and angry with /her/. That is immature and expecting the child to act as the parent. I would be upset with /myself/, because a sick child should feel comfortable telling their parents that they are ill. If not, something is /wrong/ with the way the parents are communicating with the child, as evidenced by the LW's mother's uncalled for belittling.

Re: nanchan

"I'll stop judging your father (who is a DOCTOR) for not knowing the symptoms of the LW's issue when YOU stop judging the LW's mother (who is NOT a doctor) as well."

If the LW's mother didn't know the symptoms, how could she possibly blame her daughter, a kid who has never experienced this before, for not know them?

Frankly I find your opinion on this to be very biased. In your head, someone HAS to be wrong - you waffle back and forth (whether you realize it or not) between mother and daughter, but ultimately take the mother's side (surprise) and blame the daughter for telling her mom she felt sick, but not enough (I guess?) and for going to the ER on her own (which is not indicated in the letter).

You would actually get mad at your kid if, after telling you she felt sick and you didn't react properly (take her to the doctor), she got so sick she had to the hospital? No wonder you're siding with LW1's mom. I'm pretty sure there's no way to slice that in any way but crappy parenting.

Generally, when you have a kid and a parent, and the kid seems reasonable, and it's concerning a medical bill, if you MUST blame someone, you blame the parent. In this case I don't think anyone needs to be "blamed" except the mother, for the way she handled her frustration about the bill she got, but it's certainly not the fault of the kid who told her parents she felt sick and then got really sick.

Oh, I get it. We all know from her looney rant the other day about birth control, that Nanchan makes every mother/daughter/parenting situation about herself and the fabled CC. In this case, as " the mother" in the story, she had to twist and contort and do back flips to put the mother be in the right and the daughter in the wrong. That clears up a lot!

Re: Zoe
Thanks for clearing it up for me! I haven't posted in a long, long time (since the crackdown which shut down commenting), but I remember nanchan as being reasonable and usually pretty spot on. Or at least up for a civilized debate without any putting down of the other person. So I was surprised today.

In general, I think parents are responsible for the way their kids turn out, and their interactions with them. If the kid isn't behaving as they should, at least 80% of the time, parent's should look to themselves. Case in point--my son was acting out recently, and I was at my wit's end. I realized he's moving into a different stage, and I need to adjust accordingly. I realized the way I was communicating with him was appropriate for a preschooler, but he had matured beyond that and felt insulted and acted out in retaliation. Then, I read some parenting books, and tried some new communication techniques. Voila, my happy, well adjusted son is back. :)

Re: Bean123

Yeah, back then, it was better. Since then, well... If you fancy a larf, check out March 12!

Oh for goodness sakes Zoe! go take your birth control pills and move on.

Re: Bean 123

And I'm glad you found a way that worked with your kid! I don't think parents are always responsible for their kids, I've seen great parents with shitty kids, I think sometimes nature can overtake nurture. But for the most part, you are right, and if they can't make everything perfect, parents can certainly help.

And see what I mean? LOL... girl is WAY too far up in my business (figuratively... haha).

@Bean123 & @Zoe, by way of comment #43 -- there's a halfway point between going to the doctors immediately or waiting and ending up at the ER, one that I really recommend -- and that's calling your Primary Care Physician's office or your usual health care provider, and describing your symptoms. They often can give you reassurance, or at least an opinion about what you should do and when you should come into the office.

We like to reserve use of the ER when there's no way to get to our primary health care provider in time for it to be reasonable, but that phone call to walk us through the issues involved with our symptoms can really be helpful in deciding whether to go in right away or take a "wait and see" approach.

Re: Mike H

Here in Ontario we have a service called Telehealth Ontario, it's operated by nurses. You call with your questions and they help out or recommend you see a doc.

I rarely have any need to go to a doctor, but I ended up in urgent care with a kidney infection a couple years ago. I feel for this kid because I think her mom's being a jerk. There are plenty of parents who would yell at a child for needing to see a doctor at all. If you've never met that type, be glad.

I think the girl has one of those moms who just doesn't care that much about her.
Mine didn't. I was telling her for YEARS that I couldn't see well, and she flat out told me I was a liar and just wanted glasses because one of my friends wore them. In the late fifties/early sixties??? NOBODY wanted glasses then, because it would just set you up for teasing and bullying and being called four eyes. I had gone through a couple years of bullying because of warts on my face and hands (dozens of them) and I was simply not important to her.
She made that crystal clear later on when I was an adult. As a female I wasn't worth anything except for what I could do for her.
I would bet that girl had experienced that sort of "quit bothering me with your problems" attitude over the years, and that's why she didn't mention the symptoms earlier.

I should also point out that when my husband had appendicitis, the young man in the room with him was 16 years old and his mother did not have insurance. Their bill came to just under $12,000 and the mother was blown away. She left the room to make phone calls and cry.

$600 doesn't sound so bad now, does it?

Also, young man or young lady, call the hospital, sometimes they have programs for low-income families. A friend of ours ended up in the emergency room and had to have an MRI. They had insurance, really good insurance and her part of the charges was $1800. She called the hospital and the billing department forwarded her call to the office that handled assistance with paying her bill. Through this office, most of the $1800 was forgiven and she ended up paying around $150.

@moon- Oh, my gosh, when I told my mom I wanted to see an eye doctor, she said- you just want to wear glasses! After a couple times when I put my head down in class, crying from an excruciating headache (again), my teacher said, tell her I said you have to have your eyes checked! When the doctor put lens on me, I had a real AHA! moment. You don't know what you can't see until you see it, right?
I bet if our moms had met, they would have been best buddies.

I think the mom was just unhappy to get a bill for a $600 ER visit when a $25 doctor visit could have solved the problem just as well. Depending on the family budget, the bill could take months to pay off. Even if not, who wants to pay an extra $575?
-
If the mom really yelled at the kid just for getting sick, that's no good. Maybe the mom just yelled because the bill was so big when it didn't need to be. The kid might not be able to tell the difference -- yelling is yelling. Maybe the kid is indulging it a bit of drama -- poor me, my mom thinks I'm worthless.
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Anyway, it's likely the kid had no idea of the difference in cost between going to see the doctor and going to the ER. Lots of people don't until they get a bill like this in the mail -- surprise!
-
I'm sure it doesn't feel like it, but an ER visit for $600 is a bargain! That must have been their copay. If they'd had to pay a deductible or some coinsurance, it could have been in the thousands.

While I think the Annies COULD be right... it's irritating as heck that they always seem to pull the "How DARE you think your mother doesn't love you! She is your Sacred MOTHER!!!!!" crap.


I mean, it's possible that LW1's Mom really does care more about the money than LW's health.


Unless the LW was actually beaten by Mom, the Annies seem to preach that Mommy is always well-meaning, just misunderstood.

What Zoe and Bean said...

Re: Mike H
Oh, I often call up our doctor's office and check with the on call nurse if they think I should wait it out or bring in my child. My point was that parents who truly care would investigate further, parents that don't would pretend it is their sick child's fault. I understand that $600 is a lot of money, but I have only ever taken my child to the emergency room once. I learned my lesson and have never needed to repeat that. You can't avoid the emergency room for things like broken bones, appendicitis, etc, but usually if you keep a tight watch on your kids symptoms, you're able to go the doctor during the day. Luckily I have a doctor who is open every day, including Sunday, and an on call nurse who I can speak to anytime between 7:30AM and 8pm, which helps. You certainly won't avoid every trip to the emergency room, but paying attention as a parent is important. And this poor excuse of a mother yelling at her daughter is only going to cause her daughter to be even /more/ uncomfortable speaking up, IMHO.

Bean - I actually laughed out loud at your comment - "In general, I think parents are responsible for the way their kids turn out, and their interactions with them. If the kid isn't behaving as they should, at least 80% of the time, parent's should look to themselves. Case in point--my son was acting out recently, and I was at my wit's end. I realized he's moving into a different stage, and I need to adjust accordingly. I realized the way I was communicating with him was appropriate for a preschooler, but he had matured beyond that and felt insulted and acted out in retaliation. Then, I read some parenting books, and tried some new communication techniques. Voila, my happy, well adjusted son is back." Your kid is, what, 5? No longer a preschooler and you can totally solve his problems by reading a parenting book. Lucky you. Wait until your kid is 17 and see if your experience is exactly the same. Kids' behavior becomes exponentially more complicated as they get older, and they are influenced more & more by their peers & the society around them. I can not take 100% credit or blame for how my now adult kids turned out. They are not just my & my husband's creations; they are actual people who make their own choices mostly good but sometimes bad. Does your mother get all the credit for everything you do right & all the blame for your mistakes? Hopefully not. We do our best as parents to teach our kids the right ways & how to make good decisions, but ultimately they own their fate, not us.

Re: Princess Bride
In all seriousness and without malicious intent, I believe you read anger even when there isn't any because you feel so much of it yourself. Like other things that you see everywhere and all the time.

Re: nanchan #37
I don't understand. Your post #37 was an excellent example of the kind of age-appropriate conversation a parent should be having with a child who's not feeling well. How come you're having such trouble realising that the LW's mother failed to do exactly that?

Re: kai archie

You're right, I think my comment came out stronger than I intended. I wasn't trying to say that a child who turns into a drug addict is entirely the parent's fault, or anything that extreme. The older the kid is, the more they are influenced by their friend circle and other adults around them.

But I do think that parents should own their behavior. I see too many parents who sit back and complain about their kids, but their kids are behaving /exactly/ as they've been taught--they are mimicking their parent's actions. Especially when the child doesn't communicate with them--I think that is very tied to how the parent has been communicating with them all along. I think all too often parents /underestimate/ their true influence on their kids. I'm not talking about discipline, I'm talking about how parents choose to live their lives and communicate with others.

I think the Annies were quite wrong about LW1. The mother very clearly stated that she was mad about the money. The Annies are using wishful thinking when they say that the mother was really just worried. Annies, you ought to know after all the letters you receive that not all parents have the best interest of their children in mind.
My own parents would have been mad about the bill because my health was not worth $600.

LW1: Jesus, sometimes i think I should be the one writing the advice column (hmmmm...?) The Annies were dead wrong. I feel most advice columnists (okay, ALL) side on the side of the parents when a teenager writes in, by default assuming the teenager is in the wrong, and that the parent always knows best. However, if an adult had written, saying that when they were a teen, their parents treated them this way - different story. Why the discrepancy?

Anyway, the analogy the Annies gave even shows how they don't know what they're talking about here. A mother running after a toddler in the street will say "Don't ever do that again - you could have gotten yourself run over and died!" However, this mom never, ever said "You could have gotten seriously ill and died!" Instead, she said "You cost me way too much money" So yes, her daughter's health is not worth $600 to her. Plain and simple. There are plenty of terrible parents out there. This is one of them. Poor daughter had the guts to write in, and is instead told her mother is an angel? No way and wow. I hope the teen knows her health is worth far more than $600, it's most like 6 billion, but too bad the mom can only think about the money. I know, $600 to some is like several months rent. Yet still, to "read me the riot act" about the money isn't just one outburst. It's an extended rant and complaint session about how her child's life isn't worth that much.

Not to mention, who the heck, especially at age 13 or 15, knows they have a kidney infection? I'm an adult and don't know what the symptoms would be. Sounds like this mom wouldn't have taken her kid to see the regular doctor even if she complained earlier, so the mom is at fault, not the child.

Re: Salty
Sure hope the kid reads BTL...