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Gauging the Godfather

Comment

Dear Annie: Bob and I are both divorced from our previous spouses. His ex-wife was unfaithful, and so was my ex-husband. We fell in love even though we live miles apart. I recently visited him for the second time to talk about our future plans. He wanted me to meet his friends, and I happily agreed.

"Tina" is a longtime family friend. Bob is godfather to two of her children. She claims to be best friends with Bob's ex-wife. But during dinner, Tina made inappropriate advances toward Bob. He finally confessed that they had a one-night stand when he discovered his wife was cheating. They swore never to speak of their tryst. This happened long before he met me, and Bob says he feels terrible about it. But Tina made sure I knew they had a sexual history. It took every bit of reserve to maintain my composure that evening.

While I have zero respect for a woman who sleeps with her best friend's man, I am also unhappy with Bob. He has done everything within his power since then to prove that he loves me and wants a future with me, including marriage, but I cannot get past the fact that he and Tina crossed a boundary and still expect to remain friendly. What kind of man would try to merge his past with his present? — Feeling Confused

Dear Confused: Bob has been honest with you, but as godfather to Tina's children, she will always be in the picture. Do you trust him not to put himself in a compromising position? That is the sole issue. You cannot change the past. You can only accept it and move forward. You and Bob might benefit from premarital counseling. He sounds worth it.

Dear Annie: My daughter is planning a wedding to a great guy, and I am thrilled for her. The problem is, he comes from a very wealthy family. I live in a mobile home. If I'm lucky, I could scratch together $3,000 to put toward their wedding, but that's it.

I don't want to use the little money I've saved toward my retirement. I've already spent a fortune on my dress, the gifts and all the little extras. So my question is, how do I offer $3,000 and say that is all I have to give toward the actual wedding? Do I need to apologize? Should I take out a loan or borrow from my retirement to save face? This whole thing is keeping me up at night. — The Bride's Mother

Dear Mother: Parents should never put themselves in hock in order to pay for a child's wedding. An adult bride and groom should pay for their own nuptials whenever possible, even if that means cake and punch in the backyard. Tell your daughter you love her very much, and you will be happy to give her $3,000 toward the cost of her wedding. Period. You don't need to apologize or take out a loan. If she wants something more elaborate, it's her problem, not yours.

Dear Annie: I read the letter from "Not Romeo and Juliet," who said that many years ago, there was some unspecified rift between her family and her boyfriend's family. Now that she and the boyfriend have reconnected and wish to marry, the families are angry and vehemently against it.

The first thing they should do is have their DNA checked. I'd bet there was an affair between two of those parents and the kids are related. - First-Time Writer from Iowa

Dear Iowa: You could be right, although the rift extends to every member of both families. While an affair seems a likely basis for the animosity, we would hope the parents would inform the couple if they shared DNA. Instead, they are vague, saying only that they won't attend the wedding. We think the couple deserves to know why.

Annie's Mailbox is written by Kathy Mitchell and Marcy Sugar, longtime editors of the Ann Landers column. Please email your questions to anniesmailbox@comcast.net, or write to: Annie's Mailbox, c/o Creators Syndicate, 737 3rd Street, Hermosa Beach, CA 90254. To find out more about Annie's Mailbox and read features by other Creators Syndicate writers and cartoonists, visit the Creators Syndicate Web page at www.creators.com.

COPYRIGHT 2012 CREATORS.COM



Comments

77 Comments | Post Comment
LW1 - aside from the fact that this happened before you met and that he has been honest with you, he is the godfather of Tina's kids. He must be at least somewhat close to them.

Tina is a threat - it seems like she is still interested in Bob if she wants to watch you squirm. You have to make a decision assuming that she may always be around. Do you trust Bob? Can you forgive the past? Have you had an open discussion about your feelings? You have to decide whether this is a deal breaker for you, but since Bob hasn't really done anything wrong (having a one night stand when you find out your wife was cheating isn't exactly good guy stuff, but I can forgive it) there is not a right or wrong answer that anyone else can give you.

LW2 - Good heavens, don't put yourself out. $3000 is more than what my whole wedding cost... Your daughter is an adult and she's marrying a dude with rich parents, you're home free! Contribute in other ways - with your time, your opinion, making meals when she's busy with prep, making flower arrangements. Talk to your future in-laws about what you can to help them out. You don't have to apologize and I'm sure no one thinks you are millionaire, but you can be upfront and say "I can't afford to contribute more than ___ but I really want to help and be part of the planning, so put me to work!" All I can say is that as a recent bride, I would NOT have wanted my mother (or anyone) to put herself out to finance MY wedding. We had our wedding in such a way that we could afford it. Any financial contribution you can safely make without risking your own finances is a GIFT. I'm sure the happy couple will appreciate it.

LW3 - I remember this one. I don't think I'd want to know if DH was my half brother! Although I suppose if kids were in the plans it would be best to get tested juuuust in case.
Comment: #1
Posted by: Zoe
Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:11 PM
*************USELESS PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT***************

LW1 refers to the first letter on 5 March 2012
Comment: #2
Posted by:
Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:24 PM
*************USELESS PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT***************

LW3 refers to the first letter on 5 March 2012
Comment: #3
Posted by:
Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:28 PM
I wonder why somebody would register under multiple names (therefore, requiring multiple e-mail addresses) in order to bully a poster on a online forum? I mean, the original poster providing the info was accused of having no life, but going to such lengths as multiple registrations just so that you could mock somebody online is indicative of having no life whatsoever. Zero. Zilch. Nada.
Comment: #4
Posted by: Ariana
Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:38 PM
LW1: Honestly, it sounds like "Tina"'s history with Bob is more than a just a one night stand. While it is not unusual for a family friend to be godfather to one child, it's a pretty CLOSE family friend who is godfather to TWO. I believe that there is a bigger story behind this whole thing, and you're not hearing it from Bob.

You have a few choices here: you can investigate on your own (talk to his other friends and family) to see what is up with Tina, or you can confront her, or you can let this go. There are definately some chicks who play things up, however usually when they do that, I find out later that they had a reason for staking their claim in the way that Tina did. Sometimes, the guy is leading on a woman (Tina) without even realizing it... more often than not, however, he's using the woman.

The Annies are right in that you have to decide if you trust Bob enough to move forward.... however, this is one instance where I don't see counseling as an option. Can counseling teach you to accept this situation? Maybe, but the more important issue is how serious you are and if you trust Bob. If you don't, move on and let tina play her games with the next chick Bob brings home to meet the family.

LW2: I don't even begin to understand why you would even want to scrape together the $3000. I would talk to my daughter and lay down the realities with her. All of my mother's daughters not only paid for our own weddings, we bought Mom HER dress and also her hotel rooms and travel expenses and even gave her spending money! You need to talk to your daughter. She no doubt expects NOTHING from you for the big day and would be dismayed to know you had even contemplated taking out a loan. Your heart is in the right place, and I know you want to do more. But just showing UP is the best present your daughter can get from you. Everything else is just cream.

PS: Did she ask you for money? If not, then let it be. This is HER wedding, let her do it her way.

LW3: Oh my! It's all a plot! If I remember correctly, the families were close when the kids were YOUNG and then suddenly (like when they were 10 or so) something happened that affected the relationship. But if you want to make this into Peyton Place, well, it is highly entertaining to speculate.

HAPPY FRIDAY ALL!
Comment: #5
Posted by: nanchan
Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:02 PM
Re: Ariana

Could not agree more, Ariana. I can only surmise that this person has run out of real life people tolerating him/her and has to resort to online fake enemies.

I have a little issue with letter 2, however, so bear with me, please. I find it very hard to believe that there have been no discussions at all about the financing of this wedding. If the rich parents of the groom understand the circumstances of the mother of the bride, why have they not discussed the circumstances of this wedding already? And the mother of the bride already bought her dress? Sensing something fake here....are the Annies setting us up for some class warfare? None of that letter rings true.
Comment: #6
Posted by: Carly O
Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:04 PM
When people appoint others Godparent to their children it always makes me wonder why. Does Bob belong to the same church as his Godchildren? Also, exactly how much religious guidance, training and counseling does he give those Godchildren? He had sex with Tina, his wife's best friend, the reasoning (which is pathetic) is of no importance. LW has no respect for the Tina yet she's willing to let it go with Bob? From the way it sounds in the letter at least Tina was single or divorced,(still immoral however) but Bob was still a married man. Bob only 'fessed up because Tina spilled the details on something they swore to never speak of. Since this is ONLY the second time LW has visited and they have been involved long enough to be in love and want to discuss the future, I suspect that Bob and Tina are friends with benefits. One time sex escapade my butt!
Comment: #7
Posted by: Cathy
Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:22 PM
LW1: What nanchan said. Can't really think of much more to add. Would be curious as to why Bob wants anything to do with his cheating ex's friend, however (seems like it'd be bad memories for him) beyond the godparent relationship. Also curious as to why Tina found it so important to let the writer know that she'd shagged the writer's boyfriend.
Comment: #8
Posted by: Matt
Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:37 PM
LW2: You're kidding, right? This nonsense about the bride's parents paying for the wedding is barbaric. If your daughter is worthy of the name, she would not accept a dime, let alone $3,000. They should have the wedding they're prepared to pay for themselves, no more. You've spent more than enough already. Go, bring your gift, and have fun. Then enjoy your retirement.
Comment: #9
Posted by: Baldrz
Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:39 PM
* * * * PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT * * * *

LW3 refers to the first letter on 5 March 2012.
Comment: #10
Posted by: Miss Pasko
Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:45 PM
LW1 - lots of people stay friends with people they've had sexual experiences before. It doesn't necessarily mean the experience will repeat. Usually it does not. Bob sounds like he understands having friends for life, which is a good thing, not bad. Tina sounds kind of jerky and flirtatious, but Bob owes you nothing, not even an explanation, for something that happened after his wife had cheated on him, and before he met you.


LW2 - Stop acting like a nitit, hon. You don't have to give your daughter $3000, or even three cents, towards her wedding. Tell her you're thrilled for her and wish you could help out financially with the wedding, but can't. Then ask if you can help out in other ways.



Comment: #11
Posted by: sarah morrow
Thu Apr 19, 2012 11:08 PM
My comment to LW2 had a typo. "Stop acting like a nitit" should read "stop acting like a nitwit."
Comment: #12
Posted by: sarah morrow
Thu Apr 19, 2012 11:12 PM
Re: It's about time someone else recognized how irrelevant and annoying these comments have been.

Useless, public disservice. True.
Comment: #13
Posted by: Linda Dorfmont
Thu Apr 19, 2012 11:46 PM
LW2-Why would you pay anything towards your daughter's wedding? The bride's family being obliged to pay for it, that's a MYTH!!!! The mother of the bride is NOT OBLIGED to give anything at all.
When my cousin was married two years ago, I declined to attend the wedding because the airfare was $300. My sister didn't go either, because airfare for her, the husband, and their three kids would've been over $1000, not to mention the hotel room. Plus, they wanted to use their vacation time to do stuff with their kids.
Your $3000 is meant for your retirement. It's unreasonable (and possibly immoral) for a wealthy family to expect you to dip into your savings. In fact I find it insulting to you.
Comment: #14
Posted by: Roger
Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:48 AM
Several people have wondered why Bob is the godfather. If his wife was her best friend she probably asked her to be godmother and Bob being her husband would be the godfather.
Wen he was vulnerable he made a mistake. He said he did not want to discuss it again and has told her he does not want to be with Tina. Just because Tina may want him doesn't mean she'll get him. Let it go, but watch out to see how they act together. If he is friendly, but not flirtatious, he thinks of her as an old friend. If he acts in a way that makes you uncomfortable then just break it off.
Lw2 if your daughter doesn't ask for money, there is no need to fork money over. Ask what you can do to help and if she says they need money give them what you can.
Comment: #15
Posted by: MT
Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:38 AM
Several people have wondered why Bob is the godfather. If his wife was her best friend she probably asked her to be godmother and Bob being her husband would be the godfather.
Wen he was vulnerable he made a mistake. He said he did not want to discuss it again and has told her he does not want to be with Tina. Just because Tina may want him doesn't mean she'll get him. Let it go, but watch out to see how they act together. If he is friendly, but not flirtatious, he thinks of her as an old friend. If he acts in a way that makes you uncomfortable then just break it off.
Lw2 if your daughter doesn't ask for money, there is no need to fork money over. Ask what you can do to help and if she says they need money give them what you can.
Comment: #16
Posted by: MT
Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:38 AM
To the un-named poster (# 2 and # 3)

I wish I'd read the comments earlier. You did a great job. You can be my deputy! I'll do odd days, you can do the even days. That means I can have a lie-in sometimes. :-)
Comment: #17
Posted by: Miss Pasko
Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:32 AM
LW1 - So much for Bob and Tina swearing never to mention their "tryst". It's unclear whether or not Bob would have broken the silence if Tina hadn't acted the way she did, but a lot of things in this letter are unclear. We can only speculate as to why Bob is godfather to two of Tina's children, or whether or not Tina has a husband. I also wonder how often the LW and Bob have actually met "in person" since this is only her second visit to where he lives. Is this possibly an on-line romance? How long have the LW and Bob actually known each other? I think the LW should visit him more often and see how he interacts with Tina and his other friends before considering marriage. There is just WAY too much here that we don't know, and I wonder how much editing Creators did on THIS one.
LW2 - I agree with the other posters who say that it is no longer the responsibility of the "parents of the bride" to pay for the wedding. That went out with hoop skirts and high button shoes! If the bride and groom are adults they should pay for their own wedding and the LW should not deplete her savings to help out. Nowhere does it say the bride expects her to pay, so she should have a heart-to-heart talk with her daughter and let her know that she can help out in many ways, just not financially.
Comment: #18
Posted by: Kitty
Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:50 AM
@ Ariana

Couldn't agree with you more! But the best way to stop all the stupidity, hard as it may be to do, is DFTT.
Comment: #19
Posted by: Kitty
Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:52 AM
LW1 - In my opinion, Tina has the hots for Bob and has had them for a long time and is going to do anything to sabotage any relationship he may have. First of all, she's no "friend" to Bob's ex-wife. I'm not saying that what his ex did (cheat) was right. Heavens no! But no "friend" goes and sleeps with his/her best friend's spouse, regardless of the situation! And no "friend" makes advances on you when you're in a relationship. Tina did that on purpose in front of the LW to try and ruin things.

This is something that the LW just has to decide on her own. Does she believe Bob when he says that he has no feelings for her and the one time was it? She has to decide whether or not she can accept the situation.
P.S. - I wonder if Bob's ex knows that her "best friend" boinked her husband???

LW1 - Apolgozie for what? You haven't done anything wrong. No parent is obligated to pay for their child's wedding. Do NOT go broke for this. Do NOT spent your retirement on this. I'm sure your daughter already knows that you don't have a lot of money.

As for your dress that you already spent a fortune on....did you keep the tags on it? If so, return it and get a cheaper one. My mother's best friend's son is getting married in a few months and she bought a beautiful mother-of-the-groom dress for $35. It was on the clearance rack of a department store. You would never know it was $35...it's beautiful!
Comment: #20
Posted by: Michelle
Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:39 AM
Re: Trolls, what comments are useful, etc. Let's get real, people. Every single one of our comments, by every single one of us, is "useless", pretty much. This is a free entertainment. If you don't enjoy it, or if you feel that EVERY SINGLE POST has to conform to YOUR PERSONAL STANDARDS of beauty, "usefulness", etc, for you to enjoy this site, then YOU'RE THE ONE WITH THE PROBLEM -- and you're never going to get your way. There will always be someone who you dislike or some style of posting that irritates you. Big deal, that's life, get over it.

However, I think most people who go out of their way to slam other posters here aren't sincere in what they are complaining about -- they are just looking for attention themselves or have some other personal problem that makes them behave in anonymous, childish, bullying ways.

LW1: At your age, anyone you date will have a "past". This is Bob's past. She will apparently always have some role in his life because of the godchildren. He didn't really do anything wrong, which you acknowledge, so you need to figure out if you can trust him and put up with the occasional appearance of Tina in your life with Bob. Is he worth this? Because the situation is unlikely to change just because you want it to.

LW2: Your daughter is probably already acutely aware of your financial situation, so I don't think your dilemma should come as any sort of shock to her -- unless there's a lot more to the story? Have you spoiled her her entire life? Have you hidden your financial distress? (Seems unlikely, if you live in a mobile home, that you've somehow fooled your daughter into thinking you were actually Miss Moneybags).

Just sit her down for a coffee and admit flat out that, as she probably already knows, money is tight and you aren't going to be able to help a lot for the wedding. Odds are, she and her intended have already planned for this.

LW3: The entire original letter sounded a bit soap-opera-y, and I think I was one of the original BTL'ers who suggested exactly what LW3 today suggested, although I was half-joking. Only half because, well, stranger things have happened in real life.

The issue seems to be that no one in either family would tell either of the two WHY the families were so adamantly against their union. That's suspicious in and of itself, and does suggest a soap opera or Maury Povich or Jerry Springer answer.


Comment: #21
Posted by: Mike H
Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:47 AM
Mike H, I couldn't agree with you more about BTL comments. It is entertainment, but comments I have read have been incredibly helpful. It's a fun way to check out first thing in the morning, and hearing about issues that other people have. So, comment away!
Comment: #22
Posted by: happymom
Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:30 AM
LW1: So we know that Tina was inappropriate. How did Bob react, then and afterward? Embarrassed? Angry? Nonchalant? Did he ask you to just excuse her because "that's just the way she is?"

Because I think Michelle's right. Bob may feel terrible about their tryst, but Tina doesn't. If they 'swore to tell no one" -- she's breaking that vow with her behavior. Without apology. Bob may THINK Tina is a friend, but she's taken on that guise to be close to him however she can. (Wouldn't surprise me if she'd become besties with his then-wife simply to have him in her life somehow -- in which case, it's not so surprising that she'd betray his wife's friendship.) And yes, she's now out to let any future romantic possibilities that SHE has a claim on him. Bob may have taken her at her word, but I don't think there's anything wrong with suggesting that you find it puzzling that someone who swore never to tell anyone about their one-night tryst would go out of her way to act provocatively around someone Bob introduced her to as a a romantic interest. Is that how friends act?

LW2: Agree mostly with Zoe -- except I'd hold the opinions except when specifically asked for them. :) Seriously, hold your head up, Mom. What you don't realize: your gift not to tap into your retirement savings and not to go into debt is a HUGE gift to your daughter and future son-in-law. If it makes you feel better, try this: "Hon, I'm happy to give you kids $3,000 toward your wedding. I wish it could be more -- I think all parents wish they could say yes to everything without repercussions. But I'm reluctant to tap into my retirement savings, because my real gift to you is to provide for myself as long as I'm able. Marriage is tough enough without dependent parents, and I want yours to be the happiest marriage ever."

LW3: (It doesn't matter to me WHO provides the public service announcements, as long as they're steering me accurately. I do appreciate when someone with great search skills takes a moment to post a pointer, because my own search skills aren't as spot-on. Thank you. )

I wonder if the original LW mentioned to family members: "We're thinking of getting DNA tests to see whether we might be related. Of course we don't want to, but all this secrecy and vehemence makes us wonder whether there was an affair that broke the trust between our families." That might break the silence. Oftentimes when secrets are being kept, they'll see full light of day when the holder of that secret realizes that others not in on it are guessing the true nature -- or inventing something far worse.
Comment: #23
Posted by: hedgehog
Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:47 AM
LW1 -
I don't want to know how much Bob is tripping on his own two feet trying to prove to you how he loves you - this is nothing but election campaign stuff. How is he behaving in the presence of the woman and how did he react to these "inappropriate advances"? That is the key to the question.

That, and your level of tolerance towards a permanent fixture (Bob is the godfather of her children) who seems determined to behave like a cheap skank (among other things), making a play for your man right in front of you. Unless there is more to it than Bob admit and they're still involved.

Chances are they're FWB, and the woman wants more. In which case that woman will perceive YOU as the intruder. I would walk away if this turns out to be the case, because the situation is unlikely to change - considering she'll always be around and will continue to throw herself at him.

If they truly this was just a one-night stand and the woman is just anxious to increase the number... I don't know how much a godfather can disengage himself but, unless Bob finds a way to avoid the woman while remaining involved in the children's life, I can predict this situation will soon grow old - and a deal-breaker.

@Sarah Morrow
"Bob owes you nothing, not even an explanation, for something that happened after his wife had cheated on him, and before he met you."
I don't agree with you. If the woman's behaviour was perfectly correct, you would be right, and he certainly doesn't owe her an account of every one of his sexual encounters, even with women who may still be in his entourage, as long as there is nothing inappropriate going on.

But confronted with the mother of his godchildren's going for him right in front of her, a "this is none of your business" attitude would go over like a lead balloon, and rightfully so.

When a woman makes a play for a man right in front of the woman in his life, the clear message she sends is, "You, the little nobody thingie by his side, you don't matter. And the proof of which is, I'll go for him right in front of you, as if you didn't exist, because truly, you don't". He certainly DOES owe her an explanation as to why she would be treated so crudely by a woman who is sure to be a permanent fixture in his life.

Personally, any man who would refuse to tell me why I'm being treated so shabbily would be dumped right there and then, and I would leave the two spoiled eggs to rot in the same basket. You have to respect yourself in order to be respected by others.

LW2 -
If your daughter had a decent bone in her body, she would flatly refuse even 3000$. There is no reason why you should pluck food out of your mouth to make her a gift she doesn't even need.
Comment: #24
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Fri Apr 20, 2012 5:17 AM
@Ariana, Mike H
I find it interesting that someone who called Miss Pasko every name in the book and a "useless" PSA is now trying to upstage her. Do I detect a whiff of green envy here? I did, I did, I did thaw a puttycat!

Comment: #25
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Fri Apr 20, 2012 5:24 AM
@ LW 1: You do not know this guy. You do not know anything about his life. Slow the heck down.

@ LW2: Is it coming as news to your daughter that you live in a trailer? Is it coming as news to her fiance? To her future in-laws? I should hope that the outcome of the conversation you need to have with her immediately is that she is shocked and horrified to learn that you ever gave yourself a moment's stress about this.

You say she “is planning” a wedding. Does that mean specific arrangement-making is already in progress? They know the date, the venue, the caterer, etc.? If so, evidently you were not part of those conversations; so why do you think you are being expected to pony up at all? Surely you did not rear someone who thinks she is entitled to order whatever she wants and present you with a bill, without first getting your okay on the order. The fact that you and she have not discussed any specifics suggests to me that the couple are going ahead with their own plans fully intending to pay for it out of their own pockets (or possibly out of his parents' pockets).

Why spend a fortune on a “dress, the gifts and all the little extras” you cannot afford? Either you are mindlessly following orders from a spoiled, self-entitled daughter (in which case, stop that); or you are equally mindlessly conforming to some rigid, unrealistic programming in your own mind about what the mother of the bride is “supposed” to do (in which case, please reprogram yourself instanter); or you are mindlessly trying to keep up with the rich Joneses, possibly in an attempt to buy in to the wedding planning (in which case, good grief).

COMMUNICATE.

And by the way, if they accept one penny from you they're both dorks.

@ Lise: I t'ot I taw dat same puddytat!

Comment: #26
Posted by: Khlovia
Fri Apr 20, 2012 6:24 AM
Re: Ariana

"I wonder why somebody would register under multiple names (therefore, requiring multiple e-mail addresses) in order to bully a poster on a online forum? I mean, the original poster providing the info was accused of having no life, but going to such lengths as multiple registrations just so that you could mock somebody online is indicative of having no life whatsoever. Zero. Zilch. Nada.
Comment: #4
Posted by: Ariana "

What'd I miss?? This sounds quite ominous, but I can't find what you're referring to.

(Oh, and HIDEOUS PUSTULES to the people at AP who accepted "hopefully"... grrrr gnash snarl...)
Comment: #27
Posted by: Samantha Kimmel
Fri Apr 20, 2012 6:55 AM
Ariana:

I was going to add "Please tell me where to look!!!" but posted too quickly.

Would that qualify as "premature ejaculation"??? ;)
Comment: #28
Posted by: Samantha Kimmel
Fri Apr 20, 2012 6:57 AM
To LW#1-----------We don't know Bob and have no way to judge his sincerity as far as being sorry he once cheated on his wife (AFTER she had cheated, as if that makes it all right). He didn't tell you, his current girlfriend, till he was forced to by the behavior of the woman he slept with.
(No, no one owes an explanation of their sexual past before they met you-----UNLESS it is a reflection on their moral character, as in cheating on a spouse.) You have a right to know that before going into a marriage.
So you'll have to make your own decision as to his trustworthiness and moral character. But you don't have to accept Tina's being his life, since she made a point of inappropriate behavior with him in your presence, and of letting you know they had a history. Is he willing to cut her out of his life?
And no, the Annies are wrong to suggest that she MUST remain a part of his life because of his being a godfather for two of her kids. For Pete's sake, if someone who was a godparent molested your kid, for example, you'd cut them out of your life and the heck with the kids losing a godparent. There are more important things here.
Test the issue. Ask him to get Tina (AND, coincidentally, her kids, which she will use as a reason to stay close) out of his life completely, or break this off. You don't need her to become your good "friend" like she is to his ex-wife. Nobody needs 'friends' like that.
----------
Re LW#2----------If I ever got absolute power, I think I would ban expensive weddings completely-----or at least make a rule that the bride and groom foot the bill themselves. What a stupid, outdated, barbaric custom it is to expect that, when you become an ADULT and marry, your mommy and daddy, or spouse's mommy and daddy, foot the bill!!!!!! LW needs to keep her $3,000 for the time when she needs to replace the roof on her trailer, not spend it so daughter can sashay around in a fancy dress in a fancy church and everyone can eat shrimp and lobster.
--------
Re LW#3--------The theory of them being related might be far-fetched, but I have no sympathy for someone telling another person not to do something and giving no reason. If someone can't provide a valid reason, with which they agree, they should ignore their families, marry, and move far, far away.
Comment: #29
Posted by: jennylee
Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:01 AM
Re: Samantha Kimmel
It would appear that Kyle, Miss Fatso and today's nameless poster (among others) are all the same person, using sock-puppets to do her dirty work. It would appear that, as anonymous as an Internet username can be, it's still not secret enough that some posters don't feel the need to hide behind a sock-puppet even when their username is not their real name. That's what you've been missing. Hope that helps.

Comment: #30
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:16 AM
@Miss Pasko -- usually, I'm a true believer in DFTT, but I have to say, your response was perfect!
Comment: #31
Posted by: Lisa
Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:21 AM
@ Anyone Religious at the BTL

As my parents didn't raise me in a specific religion, I didn't have godparents, so I am definitely unclear as to what sort of role they have and how important they are. I am sure it differs from family to family. My (albeit limited) understanding is that godparents are theoretically in charge of the child's religious instruction to some degree or another, but even the people I know who have godparents or are godparents haven't had hardly anything to do with anyone's religious instruction. From what I've seen, "godparent" is simply a title given as an honorific and nothing more. IF that's the case (and again, maybe it isn't -- I just don't know much at all about godparents) then to be honest, "Tina" needn't be a permanent fixture. But if he really does have a significant relationship with the kids that he wants (and should) maintain, Bob needs to consider only seeing "Tina" when the children are around.

But honestly, I'm asking, because I don't know how these things really work (or are supposed to work).
Comment: #32
Posted by: Lisa
Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:33 AM
Re: Lisa
I was named godmother to my eldest half-brother and, believe me, it was never anything but honorific. I believe what a godparent is has evolved/devolved a lot in the past hundred years, to the point where it can have a totally different meaning and social significance, depending on the community.

Comment: #33
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:42 AM
I want to express my thanks to Miss Pasko for the very relevant information that you are posting. **************
LW1: As someone said, you don't know this guy. SLOW DOWN.
LW2: Geesh, I didn't know it wasn't an obligation of the bride's parents to pay for the wedding. I must be way behind the times! Anyway I already told my daughter we would pay up $1,000 or maybe $1,500 and not to expect a cent more. Not that she's engaged yet, but her boyfriend has mentioned children and marriage. Apparently his parents are willing to help out too. They've been together for several years and lived together for the last one. She just finished college and he's doing an apprenticeship. With the horrific prices for rent in Ontario at this time, they really can't afford it themselves. Her cousins' parents just put on a very expensive wedding for one of their daughters ... I sure hope she doesn't think she has to match that ...
LW3: I agree with the suggestion to have your DNA checked, at least before you choose to have children ... I don't think much of parents who won't confess the truth in these circumstances, for sure.
Comment: #34
Posted by: melinda
Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:03 AM
My understanding is that a godparent is a person who has made an agreement to take on responsibility for the child's welfare should the parents die.
Comment: #35
Posted by: melinda
Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:05 AM
LW1 sounds like a controlling wench.

If this same letter was from a man about his girlfriend, the Annie's would have tore into him and told him to quit being jealous.

I love man haters.
Comment: #36
Posted by: Filthy McNasty
Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:27 AM
This is a serious question for posters: Many BTL'ers, today, have posed the question “If Tina hadn't told the LW, would Bob have come clean?” Do you believe he needs to? It happened way before he met the LW, why should he tell her about it? I'm just looking for a perspective different from mine. I get the feeling if he had feelings for Tina, or if they are friends with benefits, he wouldn't have introduced the LW to her. I, also, get the feeling Tina doesn't feel that way…
Comment: #37
Posted by: Casey
Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:33 AM
Re: melinda
I don't think so. Godparents dont have to be married. They could be a guy from 1 side of the family and a woman from the other side. They are supposed to assist in guiding the child's religious upbringing, but don't actually have to even know each other. Although it is usually an aunt/uncle, close married friends of the parents, etc.
But if you're right, I'm 1 disaster away from 4 kids!
Comment: #38
Posted by: TJ
Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:33 AM
Samantha Kimmel #28: Posts 2 and 3. They look like Miss Pasko's posts, but if read closely, you'll see the title says “Useless Public Service Announcement” and I thought you said you were gone for good.. why are you posting here?

Hahaha! I'm TOTALLY kidding!! I'm glad you're back :) I thoroughly enjoy your posts!
Comment: #39
Posted by: Casey
Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:36 AM
I don't normally jump into the personal issues on this forum, but WHO THE HELL CARES if Miss Pasko posts a message indicating where an original letter came from? Let me be clear that I don't mean this as a slight against Miss Pasko, but rather against those complaining about it. It's a three line post, highlighted with asterisks at the top. Skip the damn thing! Or if you're one of those who claim they "can't" skip posts and read them anyways, then mourn the lost three seconds of your day and move on. Why on earth would anyone get upset over such a minor thing?
Comment: #40
Posted by: Jers
Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:38 AM
Re: Casey
Bob wouldn't need to "come clean" if Tina hadn't been coming on to him right in front of the LW. He doesn't have to "come clean" about every sexual encounter in his past any more that she does - we've been through this before, with BFs who demanded a complete list of names and were recoiling in horror when the total number was higher than theirs.

Perhaps Bob and Tina are still involved in some way, perhaps Tina is the one who doesn't want to let go and wants to transform a one-night stand into a relationship. We just can't know, because the LW didn't say how Bob behaves with Tina, how he reacted to her advances and what his present attitude is. But if it were truly in the past for both ex partners, then it shouldn't matter at all.

Comment: #41
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:46 AM
Re: Jers
They are not really upset. They are using this as an excuse to bully.
Comment: #42
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:54 AM
@TJ, I was born and raised Roman Catholic, and my godparents are my father's eldest brother and my mother's eldest sister. My understanding of their role was that they would ensure my continued upbringing as a Catholic, not necessarily only if my parents died, but also if my parents seemed to be slacking off on the job. My aunt, at least, tried to take her role seriously when at the age of 20 I left the Catholic Church.

A completely different man and woman, a married couple who were friends of the family, were designated my "guardians" in case both of my parents died. So in my case, at least, "godparents" and "guardians" were not the same thing at all.
Comment: #43
Posted by: Mike H
Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:03 AM
I was blessed to have a wonderful mother who offered to pay for my wedding. She had ovarian cancer, and I think she realized she didn't have much time left, so she took quite a bit of her investment money and gave it towards my wedding. But I would give anything in the world to have had a backyard wedding with fruit punch, and still have my mother here, than have the lavish wedding that I received. Point being, your daughter will just be happy you are there!
Comment: #44
Posted by: Emily
Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:05 AM
Re: Lisa

re: godparents. In my religion, godparents serve two purposes. While the parents are alive, the godparents are supposed to provide religious guidance. During the baptism of a baby, the godparents are tasked with this by our minister. They are also told to look after the welfare of the child in the event that the parent is unable to. In my culture/heritage, being a godparent is one of the highest honors a parent can bestow on a family member or friend.

In the case of my daughter, I brought her back to the US when she was 5 months old to be baptised. My brother and my sister are her godparents: I chose them because if something were to happen to me, she would have been raised by them. I also had this written into my will, but back "in the old days" (ie when my grandparents and parents were being raised) the child would be given to the godparents (usually a married couple back then) to be raised if something happened to the parents. Traditionally, in my family/culture/religion, family members are chosen. My own godparents are my uncle and his wife, and to this day, on my birthday every year, they send me devotional books and Bibles.
Comment: #45
Posted by: nanchan
Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:10 AM
Casey, (and sarah morrow), What's needed from Bob is an apology and an explanation NOT because he chose to sleep with Tina but because Tina was uncivil to LW. As far as LW knew, Bob was interested in her romanticallly, and the two of them were introducing each other to other people who are important to them. And yet, one of those friends acted rudely to LW by making advances toward Bob.

If I were LW, such an encounter would leave me wondering whether perhaps I had misunderstood Bob's feelings about me (or been led to do so) -- whether perhaps Bob's REALLY interested in Tina, and using me to make her jealous or get her to finally admit her feelings for him.

THAT is the reason that honesty is needed about Bob's history with Tina. Had Tina kept her vow to remain forever mum about the tryst, LW would NOT be justified in asking (much less pressing) Bob whether they'd ever dated, made out, slept together etc.

But Tina did not abide by her agreement with Bob. She acted in a way to make it clear that there HAD been sexual history there, despite being introduced as "friend." That absolutely justified LW asking Bob what the deal was wtth him and Tina; LW was told one thing, but Tina's actions contradicted that.

He also owed her an apology for introducing her to someone who treated her rudely. Just as I would apologize if I introduced a date to a parent and my parent behaved abominably: "I'm so sorry for putting you through that. I had no idea that she'd say such a thing. No, really, you did nothing to cause it; it's entirely on her, and on me for putting you through that.. I am so sorry, and you can be sure I'll be letting her know how unhappy I am."
Comment: #46
Posted by: hedgehog
Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:32 AM
Enough already! The arguments pro and con Ms. Pasko's *public service announcements* are beginning to grate on me as much as the "public service" announcements themselves.
Ms. Pasko the best public service that you did was to inform us on "how" to get back to original letters, if we so choose to do so. Heck, I just did it myself, following your instructions..very easy to do. Thanks for that. (not that I ever do it, I just remembered a wee bit of your instructions and went from there..).
Listen up folks, this is how to do that *service*. At the top right of this page you will see a search bar. Enter the key word's of reference to that search bar. I entered the word's "Romeo and Juliet" into that bar and voila! up came ALL of Creators referrals to those words, listed by dates and column author.
Again, thanks to Ms. Pasko for that information. I'll take it upon myself to repost these instructions every day that it's necessary to stop the stupid announcements and arguments of same. Can we all please move forward from this ridiculous debate?
Comment: #47
Posted by: aline
Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:53 AM
Re: aline
Question: What's the difference between Miss Pasko's PSAs and you "taking it upon yourself" to repost "these instructions" every day, and how would one be less annoying than the other?

Gee, the number of people suddenly vying for Miss Pasko's job!


Comment: #48
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:29 AM
@ Lise Brouillette #38
I agree totally! SHEESH - you'd think it was a PAID job, wouldn't you??
Comment: #49
Posted by: Kitty
Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:39 AM
WHOOPS! I meant Lise's comment #48, NOT #38 :(
Comment: #50
Posted by: Kitty
Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:42 AM
Re: Kitty
I guess the "attention" is worth more than a paycheck to some... although I know for a fact that Miss Pasko is only trying to be helpful and in no way doing that to be "a star".

Comment: #51
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:44 AM
@ Lise

Agreed! And she didn't start all this controversy. It's a shame when someone who's just trying to be helpful is maligned the way she's been :(
Comment: #52
Posted by: Kitty
Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:55 AM
@aline, a nice attempt at a compromise, although your instructions will probably only produce some trolls coming out to attack you for your regular, daily posting of those instructions. Best, instead, to just ignore the whole issue, and skip Miss Pasko's posts, and her detractors, as best you can.

Simply put, anyone who regularly posts anything is going to become a target at some point or another of insecure bullies who have some hole in their lives that is filled by stalking and abusing people online.

You'd only become their latest target, most likely.
Comment: #53
Posted by: Mike H
Fri Apr 20, 2012 11:10 AM
The letter concerning the wedding reminded me of an episode of the show "In Plain Site" that cracked me up when I watched it.
The younger daughter was planning her wedding to a man who's family is rich and she was feeling bad about the fact that she had no money, limited family (father was a crook who is missing), etc. Her Mother planned out an entire wedding and reception that would take place in the older daughters back yard. It would include a very small guest list due to space, home cooked food, hand made decorations, etc.
She entuseasticly presented the plan to the future inlaws who freaked, in a calm, walthy people way. They immediatly offered to take over planning the wedding and ensured the daughter and Mother that they didn't have to worry, everything would be on them. After all, they where about to become one big happy family, right?
Never even realized that they played right into the Mothers plot to get her Daughter her dream wedding.

Maybe the letter writer should watch the episode and steal the idea :)
Comment: #54
Posted by: Michelle Keane
Fri Apr 20, 2012 11:21 AM
I agree with everyone who said the mother of the future bride does NOT have to dip into her retirement account. Life is hard enough for her without taking on that extra burden. Weather or not your daughter is 18 or 28, let the happy couple pay for the nuptuals. You can be just as married as everyone else with a marriage license and a preacher or even the mayor or a judge. In 6 months no one but Mom is going to remember that wedding reception.
Comment: #55
Posted by: Cheryl
Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:18 PM
Re: Michelle Keane

Hee hee hee! Now, that's what I call manipulation techniques put to good use.

Comment: #56
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:40 PM
@nanchan, melinda, TJ, Mike H & Lise (I think that covers it) -- thanks for answering my question about godparents. Since I am not religious, obviously I have never been asked to be a godparent, but two separate sets of parents have asked me to be the legal guardian of their children should something happen to them.

@Casey -- while I'm a true believer in the "my sexual past is none of your business" school of thought, I do think there are situations when a history needs to be shared. Even if Tina and Bob only had a one-night stand, it never happened again, neither of them ever want it to happen again, no one ever spoke of it again and Tina had behaved appropriately, I think you could still make the case for sharing this information. Somehow or other, this stuff always gets out. Whether it's said by someone in anger in the heat of the moment, whether it's said flippantly in passing with no harm intended, whether someone let's it slip after too many glasses of win, whether there's just "something" about the two of them that gives it away...and none of those scenarios are ways are good ways to find such a thing out. It's one thing to not tell someone about that guy in college you've never seen again in your life. It's another thing to not tell someone about the woman who is still very much in your life. Mind you, I can also see the argument that, if it happened once, won't ever happen again, both parties have moved on and don't speak of it, and everyone behaves appropriately, then it's best not to tell because it might make the new person in your life uncomfortable around this other person. But I still think that eventually, one way or another, it comes out, and then the fact that you "hid it" for all that time just compounds the problem.
Comment: #57
Posted by: Lisa
Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:00 PM
Re: hedgehog
Hi hedgehog, if anyone needs to apologize to the LW, it's Tina, not Bob. But the LW also owes an apology to Bob for judging him inappropriately and projecting her discomfort with Tina, onto her fiancee. It's all spelled out in her last paragraph:

"He has done everything within his power since then to prove that he loves me and wants a future with me, including marriage, but I cannot get past the fact that he and Tina crossed a boundary and still expect to remain friendly. What kind of man would try to merge his past with his present?"

The LW is the one who can't get past the fact that Bob is still on good terms with a woman he had sex with before (what bothers her, very clearly, is the continued friendship). She is the one is upset that he's not severing his bond with Tina forever, and throwing away a lifetime friendship, and severing his obligation to be a godfather to Tina's children. She appears to feel that she has the right to question, judge and control every aspect of Bob's life. To me she shows evidence of being a control freak, who also feels that her fretful "feelings" should determine the shape of the world around her.

What kind of man would maintain friendships through thick and thin, admit his mistakes, and keep his commitments? A good man, I would say. I'm not certain the LW deserves him, and I suspect he may deserve better than her.
Comment: #58
Posted by: sarah morrow
Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:10 PM
LW2 -- I agree with everyone who has told you that you are not obligated to pay anything toward your daughter's wedding, If you WANT to and have the ABILITY to, then that's great. But I can't help thinking there's something odd going on here. You say you've already spent a fortune on your dress, gifts, etc. How did you know what sort of outfit to buy for this affair? I presume you knew because your daughter has already told you about the date, time, venue, etc., and from that information, you deduced that you needed a fancy dress. If she's already picked a date, time and venue, then I can assure you that either she's already paying for the wedding and not expecting anything from you or the future in-laws are paying for the wedding and are not expecting anything from you -- because most venues that would require a fancy dress require deposits, which means someone is already footing the bill, and apparently it's not you. But regardless, you asked "how do I offer $3,000 and say that is all I have to give toward the actual wedding?" Just exactly like that. "Here's $3,000 for you to put toward the wedding -- it's all I can afford to give you." I don't mean to trivialize something that is causing you to lose sleep, but it really is that simple.
Comment: #59
Posted by: Lisa
Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:12 PM
LW1 - I admit to being a bit confused about the first letter. From the wording, it almost sounds as if Bob confessed the affair during dinner - especially since Tina "made sure" the LW knew there was a sexual history, and the LW could barely maintain composure during the evening. Whether or not this is how it went down, Tina sounds like a class A bee-otch, and contact with her should be avoided if you wish to remain in this relationship. Bob should get a spine and tell Tina that due to her unforgivable behavior at the dinner she is no longer welcome in his company, though he will be there for her children if there is a need. And how much importance IS attached to the godparent relationship these days? And if, no matter what, you suspect Bob hasn't given up his fondness for this woman, end the relationship and save yourself future misery and anxiety.
LW2 - What baldrz said.
Comment: #60
Posted by: Linda
Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:14 PM
Re: Lisa
"I can also see the argument that, if it happened once, won't ever happen again, both parties have moved on and don't speak of it, and everyone behaves appropriately, then it's best not to tell because it might make the new person in your life uncomfortable around this other person."
That's the clincher - Tina is NOT behaving appropriately and she hasn't moved on.

@Hedgehog
"The LW is the one who can't get past the fact that Bob is still on good terms with a woman he had sex with before (what bothers her, very clearly, is the continued friendship)."
No. It's not that Bob had sex with Tina or the continued friendship which bothers the LW, it's that Tina is still after him and right in front of her at that, which is not only rude, but crude - and quite catty. I would be bothered too, and I'n neither possessive, insecure or even particularly jealous.

Comment: #61
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:18 PM
@Lise B., hedgehog, and Lisa: Thanks for explaining that different perspective to me. I actually agree with you all (I'm quite the flip flopper :)
Comment: #62
Posted by: Casey
Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:29 PM
Re: Miss Pasko, YOU GO GIRL!!! You deserve an extra piece of that famous cheesecake. ;0)
Comment: #63
Posted by: Penny
Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:32 PM
@sarah morrow -- I really appreciated your take on LW1, because I hadn't thought about it from that perspective. I guess what I'd like to know is how Bob handled Tina's advances in the moment, because I really think that would have told us almost everything we need to know. I certainly agree that a good person doesn't ditch friends and responsibilities -- especially where children are concerned -- at the drop of a hat. And I certainly agree that a woman who is comfortable and confident in her relationship and has every reason to trust her SO shouldn't worry about whether he might cheat on her -- and, in fact, shouldn't worry about with whom he did or didn't sleep with prior to meeting her. But I think even a woman who is comfortable and confident in her relationship and who trusts her SO might be very uncomfortable at watching some woman throw herself at the SO and/or otherwise make it very clear that she's "been there and done that." And, depending on the SO's reaction, that might lead her to be a bit shaken by the whole experience, and understandably so, without her automatically being jealous, possessive and controlling.

Case in point: last winter, my husband and I went to a black tie event that was out of town for us. It was a HUGE event, so there were plenty of people there we'd never met before, but we all had a "common bond" since we were at that event celebrating the same thing. Hubby saw someone he knew, and we went over to talk with him. He was with someone we didn't know. Upon being introduced to this other guy, the other guy starts falling all over himself for me, going on and on about how fabulous I look, how lucky my husband is, etc. As it happens, I was pregnant at the time but not really showing, yet. We had only just started telling people, and indeed, we were just telling the friend at that moment -- and so, of course, the other guy is there to hear it, as well. Then he starts back up again with how great I look, how lucky my husband is, etc. And, while it's certainly nice to be complimented, he's laying it on THICK, and then he's taking my hand and asking me to run away with him, etc. And, of course, he's clearly had too much to drink (if you hadn't already figured that out...). Anyhow, my husband is not the jealous type, is not controlling or possessive and obviously he had NO reason to think I was AT ALL interested in this guy (even had I not been happily married and expecting, I would not have been interested in this guy), but the guy's fawning made him uncomfortable, and as soon as he could manage it politely, hubby steered us elsewhere. Now, obviously our situation was different. I didn't know the guy, and we're never going to see him again. But my point is that even someone who is confident in his/her relationship can feel uncomfortable and act on that be uncomfortable when someone else is throwing him/herself at the SO.
Comment: #64
Posted by: Lisa
Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:03 PM
Re: Miss Pasko, YOU GO GIRL!!! You deserve an extra piece of that famous cheesecake. ;0)
Comment: #65
Posted by: Penny
Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:13 PM
LW1--"What kind of man would try to merge his past with his present?" Uh, any normal man, or woman for that matter. What are you nuts? You claim to have fallen in love with 'Bob' yet you've only made one attempt to meet his friends. In fact, according to my calculations you've only visited him twice! Now, you're upset and questioning Bob's integrity because he has the telemetry to have a friendship with a woman for whose children he is Godfather. While I agree it was beyond ridiculous for 'Tina' to mark her territory so to speak by making it clear to you that she and Bob had a sexual history, it's more ridiculous of you to insist that Bob sever all ties with this woman (or anyone else in his life of whom you might object) because they once upon a time had a one night stand under duress. My guess is that Tina has designs on Bob, enjoys his attention, and considers you an interloper. The problem isn't Bob; it's Tina. Unfortunately, I highly doubt she's going anywhere which should make you ponder your options more carefully. My advice to you is to SLOW DOWN! You shouldn't be considering a future or marriage with Bob until you've gotten to know him a lot better and also his friends and family. Only after seeing the dynamic of his personal relationships and getting to know him better one-on-one (not on-line) will you be in a position to decide whether or not Bob is marriage material. I can't fathom why you're in such a hurry to jump back into marriage.

LW2--"So my question is, how do I offer $3,000 and say that is all I have to give toward the actual wedding?" Apparently you're operating under a very common misconception. Please allow me to break some great news! You're not obligated to pay one dime for your daughter's wedding! Likewise for her college tuition or any other expenses she might incur after she reaches the age of legal maturity. While the media and other mainstream sources might lead you to believe otherwise, the simple fact of the matter is that if your daughter wants to get married and her parent isn't in a financial position to HELP her pay, then the responsibility falls to her and her betrothed. In my opinion, your daughter would be quite selfish to accept a single penny from you let alone $3000.00. If she would greedily snatch that check out of your hand then it speaks volumes about her character. Inform your daughter that while you wish her and her fiancee the best of luck, you're not in a financial position to assist her with the wedding. My guess is that if the groom typifies most of today's youth, his coptor parents will be only too willing to swoop in and pick of the tab for the wedding, the down payment on their new love nest and probably their first car. Rest easy Mom, you've earned it.
Comment: #66
Posted by: Chris
Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:16 PM
Still disagree, sarah morrow. Yes, Tina owes her an apology, but that ain't happenin'. Tina wants Bob and is trying to discourage LW.

I don't believe LW is upset that Bob slept with Tina, but that he is trying to pass this off as in the past, and it's very much in the present, at least in Tina's mind. That's the mixing of past and present, IMO
Comment: #67
Posted by: hedgehog
Fri Apr 20, 2012 6:46 PM
Of course Pasko is posting her announcements to get attention - that's why she feels the need to post in all caps with asterisks. If she wasn't trying to get attention, she would post her referrals like any other message, without the caps and stars.
Comment: #68
Posted by: Kyle
Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:09 PM
Whatever happened to Joyce/MN? I haven't seen any posts from her in a while.
Comment: #69
Posted by: Paul
Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:11 PM
Paul - I was wondering that, too. Joyce, where are you?
Comment: #70
Posted by: Claudia
Sat Apr 21, 2012 2:35 AM
Re: Kyle
She's putting in the asterixes and caps to attract attention to the POST, not herself, so that readers who have no use for it can skip it fast. But it would seem that no consideration is ever enough for the likes of YOU. "Whoever" you're trolling for must lead a sad, lonely life in order to have time to manage all these different sock-puppets.

I takes one flick of one finger to scroll past a three-line post. But apparently you have so much time on your hands and are so pissed off at the world that you would rather do something else with that finger. I feel sorry for you, "whoever".

Comment: #71
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Sat Apr 21, 2012 4:15 AM
Re: Posts #2 and #3:

Give it up already! It's a losing battle and you are just being childish. You've stated your opinion -- let it go now! This bullshit is becoming quite tiresome.
Comment: #72
Posted by: Lynn
Sat Apr 21, 2012 8:22 AM
Hmmm.

LW2 is a fairly recently betrayed wife. This appears to be her first post being cheated on and divorced relationship.
I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest Tina was likely being friendly and had that buddy buddy thing going on that old friends do, unless she was making outright sexual comments. When one has been cheated on, it's easy to see every woman who isn't acting like a stone cold emotionless bitch to your man as a threat. Especially that recent. Come on. We've all known the woman who every time some OTHER woman if nice and friendly and chatty, she goes apeshit insisting there's sex going on. Bob has said this was a one time thing he felt bad about (for no reason. You lose your right to fidelity once you cheat, and just because someone is my best friend doesn't mean I can't be disgusted with their behaviour and help another friend out).

Oh and he continues to be friends with her because they are pretending it Never Happened. If you truly are ignoring it there's no reason to stay apart now is there?

LW2 needs to watch *Bob* and see how Bob is behaving. Tina is irrelevant frankly. And the fact she's upset they "crossed a boundary," when he was in an upset vulnerable world just blew up position, long before they ever met... this woman is not over being cheated on yet. A lot of times women dump their husband, then continue to act like a raging bitch to him. Why? Because they never worked out their actual feelings and anger about it, they just left. Then her NEXT boyfriend gets to feel the wrath. :-/

As for godfathering and religion... not all godfathers are there for religions training! Very outmoded way of thinking. They're more like an Extra Special Aunt or Uncle in most families, perhaps the person who gets custody if the child is orphaned (but not always).
Comment: #73
Posted by: wkh
Sat Apr 21, 2012 11:50 AM
First of all, thank you so much for the many responses to my letter about Bob. A lot has happened since I wrote to Annie's Mailbox.
I've known Bob for over a year and a half now. . Nope, not an Internet romance at all... our relationship has been a very expensive long-distance relationship up until about three months ago. He paid for my flights out to see him. And I paid for his flights out. First off, I'm not upset because Bob slept with Tina before he met me. That happened before my time. Actually, it's none of my business. But the manner in which Tina acted while we were having dinner was unbecoming of any woman. And watching Bob squirm throughout the entire process was very uncomfortable. At that point, anyone with a heartbeat would have wanted to know what was going on. I'm not a controlling person at all. If I have to control someone, then why in the world do I need to be with them? And in return, I do not want anyone controlling me. Bob and I enjoyed the company of each other, and wanted to introduce friends and family into our relationship.
As for Tina coming forward with an apology? She did. She admitted she wanted Bob for herself, and she knew Bob did not want her after the one-night stand. But she persisted. She has a live-in boyfriend whom she has been with for about 10 years, and she claims she and her boyfriend have an 'open relationship. Yep, more drama. I told her that I thought it would be best if we stayed a respectable distance from each other. And I left it at that.
Since all that happened, it was revealed through court documentation Tina was playing both ends against the middle during Bob and his ex-wife's divorce. She would talk to her best friend (ex-wife) about Bob...and she would do the same to Bob about his ex-wife. Yeah, that kind of drama. I saw the court papers. Bob and Tina no longer speak to each other. And I have broken off my relationship with Bob for the time being. Before all this happened, he was very good to me...and I do miss him. And yes, we all have our skeletons in our closets. But as for moving on and forward with the relationship at this point...the question remains for now.
Again, thanks for your comments. - Feeling Confused
Comment: #74
Posted by: Feeling Confused
Sun Apr 22, 2012 12:54 AM
Re: Feeling Confused

Let me just say that Tina made some inappropriate gestures during dinner, as in....going to freshen up in the bathroom with the door open. Or making comments as "You've seen me with my dress off before." I'm very glad my mother raised a civilized person.
Comment: #75
Posted by: Feeling Confused
Sun Apr 22, 2012 1:13 AM
And....he is still godfather to the two children.... Both kids are now 21 and 17 years of age. I have since relocated to the state Bob lives in....but we live about an hour away from each other now instead of several thousand miles.
Comment: #76
Posted by: Feeling Confused
Sun Apr 22, 2012 1:26 AM
Re: Feeling Confused
Thank you very much for the input, letter-writers coming down Below the Line (BTL) are always welcome.

Tina sounds like the witch of the year (I'm putting a clamp on my potty mouth for the sake of civilised company) and a poisonous snake to boot. Glad Bob is no longer speaking to her... he needs friends like her like a needs a brick wall on his feet. She and her live-in boyfriend have an "open" relationship, heh? Right. I'd be curious to know if he even knoes that!

Comment: #77
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Sun Apr 22, 2012 10:00 AM
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