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Brief-Stricken
A divorced male friend and I recently became "friends with benefits." However, I'm not receiving the same, uh, level of benefits as he is. He isn't giving me orgasms from intercourse, and his pleasuring of me is measured in seconds rather than minutes, despite my telling him that this is a problem. (I haven't felt this pressure before: "You've got 60 seconds to orgasm!") He also keeps reminding me that he doesn't want any kind of commitment. I get that, and I keep telling him so, but he's persisted with the warnings to the point where I have to say stuff like "I hear and understand the boundaries of this relationship and am in agreement with them." I've known him since we were 8, and he isn't a player. Part of me thinks he isn't attracted to me. He's fit and I'm...less-than-fit and have big boobs, and I think they freak him out. However, out of bed, we laugh and have fun and connect. Oh, what to do... — Bothered
This guy treats pleasuring you like it's something on a chore wheel.
Bizarrely, you're in "friends with benefits" relationship that's short on benefits, which is like buying a blender that doesn't blend, a Cuisinart that doesn't cuise. Unfortunately, the elusive female orgasm is especially persnickety when one's partner sets up a sexual ambience reminiscent of one of those movies where Bruce Willis and Samuel L. Jackson are staring down a ticking time bomb: "Hey, baby, just relax, lay back and let it happen — anytime before this kitchen timer I've placed on your nightstand strikes :60!"
Sure, poor Booboo might have niggling fears you'll get attached, but it isn't like you're buying baby clothes and leaving wedding magazines around. It's unlikely he'd force numerous icky conversations about boundaries on some chickie of his more recent acquaintance. But, probably because he's known you forever, he feels free to go manners-optional and let his worries all hang out: "Don't take your coat off. You won't be staying. And by the way, I'd prefer if you'd fake your orgasms. It would be so much less work for me."
Yep, this boy toy of yours is a real animal in bed — a rat gnawing away at your self-confidence. Why are you still involved with him? Well, there's a tendency to try to fix a thing instead of just bailing and to get so caught up in the momentum of your efforts that you neglect to consider whether the thing should just be put out on the curb. In continuing to get in bed with a man who can keep his hands off you and pretty much does, you're a co-conspirator in your feeling like crap. It's really damaging to be with somebody who isn't into you. Even in an FWB situation, you need a man who finds you hot — or at least is enough of a friend to give you the sense that he's undressing you with his eyes, not using them to drop a refrigerator box over you.
Epic Frail
I've had a crush on a guy who's been flirting with me at my neighborhood coffeehouse. Today, he sat by the door, watching as four elderly people struggled to go out — a couple pushing walkers and, about five minutes later, a couple who were all hunched over and using canes. I was seated in the back, but when I saw nobody was helping them, I ran over and held the door. Is his behavior a clear sign that he'd be bad boyfriend material? — Door Closing
Sometimes it's hard to know what to do when you see somebody in need. A person falls down on the sidewalk in front of you. Do you just step over him? Or do you stop and take his wallet and then step over him? In assessing people, I tend to go with F. Scott Fitzgerald's notion: "Action is character." Or, in this case, inaction. I personally don't know how you sit back and enjoy the view as a parade of infirm elderly people struggle out a door, but I do know that things aren't always as they seem. Maybe it looked like he was looking but he was in some sort of fugue state. Maybe he has a cranky, independent granny who sees any help as an insult: "Why don'tcha just throw me in a hole and stick a wreath over my head?!" If you end up going out with him, do what you should with any guy you date: Look closely at his behavior, especially when he thinks nobody's watching. Be honest with yourself if it seems a fundamental lack of empathy kept him in his seat — much as you'd like to believe that there's a rash of pranksters going around to coffeehouses and gluing all the hot guys' feet to the floor.
Got a problem? Write Amy Alkon, 171 Pier Ave, #280, Santa Monica, CA 90405, or email AdviceAmy@aol.com (www.advicegoddess.com). Alkon is the author of "I See Rude People: One Woman's Battle To Beat Some Manners Into Impolite Society."
COPYRIGHT 2012 AMY ALKON
DISTRIBUTED BY CREATORS.COM
It's Advice Goddess Radio! Amy Alkon answers your questions on love, dating, sex, relationships, and manners. Listen live every Sunday from 7-8 p.m. Pacific time, or download the podcast at the link. The call-in number during the show is 347-326-9761. This week, Amy Alkon talks with science journalist David DiSalvo, author of “What Makes Your Brain Happy and Why You Should Do the Opposite,” to help you understand common human irrationalities so you can stop screwing up your relationships (and maybe even win in Vegas).
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/amyalkon/2011/12/19/advice-goddess-radio-amy-alkon
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Comments
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21 Comments | Post Comment
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My aunt uses a walker (she's 94) and is very, very slow. When we very occasionally go out, I'm always appreciative of the people who hold a door or are patient with us if we're standing in line and she's taking a long time for something.
The fact that this guy sat there and didn't offer to help at all would give me pause. I taught my son better than that, and even though I walk with a limp now, I will rush ahead to open a door for an elderly person using a walker or a cane.
Comment: #1
Posted by: Joannakathryn
Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:45 AM
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LW1: Regulars at the BTL know that I generally believe a successful Friends With Benefits situation is right up there with Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy -- like Fox Mulder on the X Files, I WANT to believe it can happen, because it's a nice fantasy, but I know better. The irony here is, on the surface, it sounds like you and your friend have all the necessary ingredients to achieve the holy grail of FWB believers. What USUALLY gets in the way of FWB is that the two people involved either aren't really on the same page to begin with and/or, at some point, one of them slips off that page (i.e., someone suddenly wants to be more than just FWB -- they want an actual relationship with a future). Your friend's compulsion to reiterate that this is meaningless sex between two horny friends who (I assume) aren't getting any anywhere else is seated in the fact that, more often than not, what messes up FWB is that someone eventually does want more. I can't help but chuckle -- with my apologies to you -- that here we finally have two people who really do seem to be totally in agreement that this is just meaningless sex, and STILL it doesn't work.
Well, that is, it's not working for you. Apparently it is working for your friend just fine. If the sex is meaningless, then the only reason to have it is because it feels good (really, really good). If that's not happening, why on earth are you still having sex with him? Don't get me wrong, but if it's meaningless AND it's not good, why bother?
Just tell your friend that clearly the two of you aren't sexually compatible, so it doesn't make sense to keep at it. Make sure you keep it light, "hey, it was worth a try, and no harm, no foul, no bad feelings -- but I think we need to go back to being friends who don't sleep together."
And, seriously, if he's "freaked out" by your big boobs... trust me, the problem is NOT you.
Comment: #2
Posted by: Lisa
Tue Jan 10, 2012 1:58 PM
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LW2: Seriously, lady do you make it a habit to overreact and exaggerate? Was this flirty dude hired as a doorman? How is it possible that every infirm person in your city just so happened to want coffee at the same time? 4 elderly struggling to get out the door? Canes? Walkers? Oh helpless people... how do you presume they got to said coffee shop? Didn't they have to drive themselves? Or walk themselves? Or take a bus themselves? But no, you have such high expectations of a person you don't even know that you expect he is to get up from his chair not once, but 4 times!!! to open the door of an establishment that he doesn't even work at for people who obviously of their own choice made themselves mobile enough to say "hey let's go get some coffee instead of brewing it at home"? Please.... and here comes superman flying from the background "oh here, let me save the day". I had 2 little ones in strollers once and if someone flew across the room to "save" me I would be a little embarrassed and weirded out, to be honest.
End comment... I bet you hold other people to much much higher standards than you hold yourself to.
Comment: #3
Posted by: It's me
Tue Jan 10, 2012 3:43 PM
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LW1-
"However, out of bed, we laugh and have fun and connect. Oh, what to do..."
Get out of the bedroom and STAY there.
You might want to snap at one point, Okay, OKAY, I GET it already, you don't want a commitment... now, can I get some pleasure, as opposed to the wham-bam-thank-you-m'am I've been getting?
It's very obvious this guy is not into you, except that he does GET into you in order to get his release... You are being treated like a hole in the wall. Let him get a blow-up doll or indulge in a five-finger-solo... Right now, what he's doing with you is little more than masturbation with a partner.
P.S.: If this is how selfish he is, no wonder he's divorced...
P.P.S: Plenty of guys just lo-o-o-ove a woman with big boobs and a fat ass.
It's called being curvacious and fertility idols of the old time looked exactly like that. This idea that women should look like an androgynous pencil is recent and fashion industry-made - becasue the camera adds ten pounds (at least) to the appearance and (especially), because designers design stuff that only looks good on a hanger, and so models have to look like a hanger.
Men's tastes in women have no changed that much because of that since the time of the fertility idols, the proof of which, I see grossly obese women in my burough all the time and they ALL have husbands and a slew of children in tow. You need to ditch that loser (at least as a lover) and find one of those. (From your description of yourself, the ex-LOML would have found you SUPER-hot)
LW2-
I no longer use public transportation on a regular basis but, personally, when someone offers me a seat, I would rather have the seat than get indignant as to why I look like I need it. Let's face it - i may be very good-looking still, but I'm not 20 anymore, and my repeatedly badly injured dancer's feet and ankles sure know it.
But I do know some people who get all insulted when someone opens a door or offers a seat, as in, "Do you think I'm so decrepit" and all that. So I'll give this guy the benefit of the doubt - perhaps he was looking but not seeing because his mind was elsewhwere (as Amy suggested)... or perhaps he's had bad experiences and he's gun-shy.
Do go out with him if you get the opportunity, but watch for signs of insensitivity. It's entirely possible that you won't find any.
Comment: #4
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Tue Jan 10, 2012 8:31 PM
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LW1 - A friend wouldn't make you feel frustrated,used,and insecure about your appearance. You should tell your selfish acquaintance that his benefits have expired . You'll feel better about yourself if you stop seeing this user.
Comment: #5
Posted by: Michael
Tue Jan 10, 2012 9:53 PM
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@It's me -- I was ambivalent about LW2. On the one hand, I can think of any number of reasons that the guy might not have helped those people that do not besmirch his character in any way. On the other hand, if he really did see those people and was in a situation where it would have been pretty easy for him to help them, I can see how it might make you wonder. But clearly, you were not ambivalent at all and came down pretty hard on the LW, and I couldn't help but want to point out a couple of things.
First, you accuse her of exaggerating -- and then you turn right around and do the exact same thing. "But no, you have such high expectations of a person you don't even know that you expect he is to get up from his chair not once, but 4 times!!!" She didn't expect him to get up four times. It was two couples, which means there were only two occasions when someone might have offered help. Then you go on what sounded to me like a bit of a tirade that these two elderly couples had the AUDACITY to want to go to a coffee shop instead of just staying home. Followed by your comment that you'd have been embarrassed if someone had stopped to help you when you had two little ones in a stroller. Really? I can't tell you the number of times I've been out with my little boy when I'd have been GRATEFUL if someone stopped to hold a door for me so I could get both myself and the stroller through without having to get banged up in the process.
I assume you exaggerated in response to what you felt was the LW's exaggeration, but your response managed to come off even more over the top than the original letter. If that was your intent, then bull's eye!
Yes, I think the LW might be reading a bit too much into the behavior she witnessed. I think her coffeehouse crush deserves the benefit of the doubt instead of being harshly judged for something that might easily be explained away. By the same token, I think the letter writer deserves the benefit of the doubt that she's simply a thoughtful person who occasionally reads a little too much between the lines -- as opposed to some hypocritical, hyperbolic jerk, as you suggested.
Comment: #6
Posted by: Lisa
Wed Jan 11, 2012 6:49 AM
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@Michael -- you are so right. Not only does she need to get off the FWB gravy train, but she may want to reconsider just what kind of a "friend" this guy is.
Comment: #7
Posted by: Lisa
Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:37 AM
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@ Lisa, yes I did come across harsh. I think it was my general mood that day. However I did not mean to insinuate that the elderly should not have left their homes. What I was saying was just the opposite... that these 4 people chose of their own feel will to leave their homes for coffee as opposed to staying home which is presumably easier. If they were that infirm they would have chosen to stay home as opposed to go through the trouble and possible injury of going out. But they must have been well enough to be out and about and while opening a door for someone if you yourself are also at the entry might be expected but getting out of ones chair while dining to help someone is sorta over the top expectations. And OP who ran over from the back of the room is way over the top for the situation.
Comment: #8
Posted by: It's me
Thu Jan 12, 2012 10:16 AM
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It's me--if you're referring to me as the OP, then you misunderstood. I would never rush "from the back of the room" but if I'm approaching a door at the same time as an elderly person, I will try to open it for them.
We took my aunt out for her birthday yesterday and I was very appreciative of the people who saw us trying to help her slowly navigate with her cane and held the doors at the restaurant. One man was ahead of us and stopped and held the first door, so once we got inside, I thanked him and told him to please go on ahead.
I've never found that being helpful and polite puts out anything but good karma. And we're all getting old, day by day.
Comment: #9
Posted by: Joannakathryn
Thu Jan 12, 2012 10:27 AM
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@Joannakathryn -- I'm pretty sure It's me was referring to the LW when referencing "OP" -- which I assumed meant "other person." In other words, the guy at the coffee shop was sitting down and shouldn't be expected to interrupt his meal to stand up and hold the door for those folks, and then the "other person" who ran from the back of the room to help them was over the top. It's me, you can let us know if I got that right or not -- I don't want to put words in anyone's mouth.
@Its me -- actually, I really did understand what you were trying to say and didn't honestly think you were suggesting that old people (or anyone else) who might wind up needing help should do the rest of us a favor and just stay home. It just seemed a tad harsh. But I do see your point about the difference between someone who just happens to be in a position to help (i.e., I'm going through the door myself, may as well hold it open for the person behind me who's struggling with a stroller, a walker, whatever), and someone having to interrupt what they're doing (like the guy who was sitting by the door of the coffee shop -- sure, he was by the door, but it's not like he was standing or going through it himself) in order to help someone.
And I'll go a step further and also suggest that if the two elderly couples in question really needed help, one hopes that someone who WAS in an "easier" position (i.e. standing by the door) to help them would do so, and the fact that the LW had to dash across from the back of the room to help them MIGHT mean that no one else in the room thought either of these couples needed any help, and the LW's response was, in fact, over the top, as you suggest.
I think it's more likely that no one else in the room happened to notice the two elderly couples might need help, because no one else in the room had a crush on the guy sitting by the door, and therefore no one else was looking that way!
In any event, I think we both basically agree that judging this guy based on his "non-response" to the two elderly couples is probably unfair, and now that I have your added clarification, I agree with the rest of what you had to say, too. Hope you're in a better mood today! ;)
Comment: #10
Posted by: Lisa
Thu Jan 12, 2012 11:05 AM
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Re: Lisa--You're probably right. I took "OP" to mean "original poster" and was thinking he was referring to the first person BTL.
Comment: #11
Posted by: Joannakathryn
Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:10 PM
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LW 1: It's friends with benefits, not a guy with a friend who happens to be a hole in the wall. If you're not getting any benefit out of the arrangement, then discontinue it. If asked why you're no longer putting out, just say that you feel that the two of you worked better as friends without the benefits.
In my experience with FWB arrangements, just start saying no. No one usually ever asks why the arrangement is coming to a close. Just don't make a big deal out of anything. If asked, be honest (see above), but, you don't need to call your friend up and tell him that his benefits have expired or anything.
Comment: #12
Posted by: Shannon
Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:55 AM
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""This idea that women should look like an androgynous pencil is recent and fashion industry-made - becasue the camera adds ten pounds (at least) to the appearance and (especially), because designers design stuff that only looks good on a hanger, and so models have to look like a hanger. ""
I preferto think that the reason those designers pick stick looking models is because they want the women to have the bodies of the young guys they are attracted too. Any straight designer, male of course would chose a woman with some curves.
Comment: #13
Posted by: Socal
Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:05 PM
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LW1- The LW's experience with the man in question leaves her feeling rejected and undesirable. Even if she decided to spend time with him as an ex-lover(who didn't show the slightest concern for her needs) she would still feel that there is something wrong with her(when there isn't;her sex partner is just selfish). She clearly wants more than a minute of sex from the man,and feels rejected by him. A friend wouldn't let a friend feel this way. Spending more time with this acquaintance will cause more doubt and pain for the LW.
Comment: #14
Posted by: Michael
Fri Jan 13, 2012 8:17 PM
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Re: Socal
That would appear to make sense... except that, even if they're overwhelmingly so, not all male designers are gay, and not all designers are male. I don"t remember Stella McCartney using models that were so curvy. I just did an image Google search, and the models showing her designs are all skinny as a rail.
Comment: #15
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Sat Jan 14, 2012 8:02 AM
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Re: Socal and OP of topic
Fashion designers trend toward the 'stick' figure because it is easy to dress. Women of curves are of very different curvy sizes and much harder to use as blank slates. Runway models are supposed to be completely interchangeable. Models with contracts and set gigs (like the Victoria's Secret Angels) are allowed to fill out more (although it may not seem like much to you, it's a godsend to them) because their work is tailored specifically to them.
Fashion designers make one copy for the runway, and it is expected to fit all of the models.
Note: I am not saying that this is a good thing. But I am a fashion-design-school-dropout and this is pounded into our heads, and I suppose it would be quite logical if we weren't talking about human beings.
Comment: #16
Posted by: Andrea
Sat Jan 14, 2012 8:45 AM
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LW1: Wow, keep ahold of this guy - he's a real winner. The real problem here is you. You have low self-esteem. If you feel bad about how you look then do something about it. Punishing yourself by getting involved with a dirtbag isn't the way to go.
LW2: You know the answer to your question. He's a jerk. Use him for amusement sake then move on.
Comment: #17
Posted by: Diana
Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:56 PM
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LW1--"I've known him since we were 8, and he isn't a player. Part of me thinks he isn't attracted to me." That's obvious, otherwise you'd be more than his milkmaid. Let me see if I have this figured out, your male friend is probably a two-pump-chump because he's carrying all sorts of emotional baggage from his recent divorce. He hasn't distanced himself far enough from it to start dating in earnest so he's fumbling around with you in the interim. You're "less-than-fit" which means you probably have self-esteem issues that affect your own ability to form healthy relationships. You and your friend have come together between the sheets, so to speak, through dysfunction and now you're wondering what you should do because you don't connect in bed the way you do in real life. Here's what you do: stop sleeping with your friend. He needs to recover from his divorce and he needs your friendship and support. You need to realize that you're worthy of an honest to goodness boyfriend including all the benefits that entails both in and out of the bedroom. Sex with friends is complicated on many levels, as you're figuring out some friendships aren't strong enough to survive it. There are plenty of fish in the sea and many of those are willing to meet your "needs" without strings attached and without the added complications that come from knowing you since you were eight.
LW2--"Is his behavior a clear sign that he'd be bad boyfriend material?" If you have to ask, then the answer is a clear "YES". Think about it.
Comment: #18
Posted by: Chris
Sat Jan 14, 2012 6:57 PM
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''Friends with beneifts''. It might not be a matter of him being into you, or not into you. Only about 1 man in 10 is worth wasting your time on in bed. It is too bad they are so hard to find. But, this figure of 10% is absolutely correct. Most men are just lousey in bed.
Comment: #19
Posted by: Carolynne
Sun Jan 15, 2012 6:15 AM
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Only 1 man in 10 is worth anything in bed. Don't blame yourself for things being bad here. Any woman who knows what a good man is like would consider this guy a lost cause in bed.
Comment: #20
Posted by: Carolynne
Sun Jan 15, 2012 6:32 AM
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Re: Andrea
What you say makes sense. Unfortunately, it seems to lead designers to design stuff that ONLY looks good on a stick.
Comment: #21
Posted by: Lise Brouillette
Sun Jan 15, 2012 9:55 AM
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